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Re: automatic/mechanical watches on a budget.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
NYCfixie
Never heard of Yema (but I do personally stick to well known brands).
Yema is a legit watchmaker with a solid history. Made in France, in-house movements, etc. Fully taking advantage of its history to put out vintage-style pieces today.
To put a bow on the thread: Yema dropped out of sight for a few decades after being bought by....Seiko. They're French-owned once again. (Thank you wikipedia for that last bit.)
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Re: automatic/mechanical watches on a budget.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
zambenini
Yeah, I think 40mm is gonna be too small after almost four years liking 42mm ok. :( I want it though.
And no 007s because I am committed to a blue dial and bezel. It's my favorite color. Cain't hep it. Hmm, I think I'm talking myself out of Submariner copies and into a Samurai. Found a new one for circa 300 on fleabay from a dealer. Now, to run this by mi esposa.
I wouldn't take the sizes as absolutes. Every watch case is different. A 42mm slab sided Tudor doesn't wear the same as a 42mm SKX. I wouldn't rule out the Squale just because of the diameter without having worn it. Some wear big, some wear small, some just fit plain weird.
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Re: automatic/mechanical watches on a budget.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
theflashunc
I wouldn't take the sizes as absolutes. Every watch case is different. A 42mm slab sided Tudor doesn't wear the same as a 42mm SKX. I wouldn't rule out the Squale just because of the diameter without having worn it. Some wear big, some wear small, some just fit plain weird.
Yep, I think I'm back to wanting the Squale again. :cool:
There is a v. cool Squale 50 ATM that just came across my radar... manoman do I like these things. Might have to sell a bike to get one.
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Re: automatic/mechanical watches on a budget.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
zambenini
Yep, I think I'm back to wanting the Squale again. :cool:
There is a v. cool Squale 50 ATM that just came across my radar... manoman do I like these things. Might have to sell a bike to get one.
The cost jump from 20ATM ~$500 to 50ATM ~$859 is significant so make sure the design is really important as the depth rating difference is meaningless in real life.
Squale, Steinhart, Sinn, and Damasko are all very good and very underrated options in the $500 to $1500 range.
It has been shared in the timepieces thread before (by me and others) that "Grand Seiko USA" is trying to move upscale in the market and truly compete with the Swiss (i.e. Omega and Rolex). They make fantastic watches but the brand recognition is not yet there and as such they do not hold their value in the secondary market so many state they are overpriced. The side effect is that "Seiko USA" has raised prices and held dealer discounting to 20% so people are now paying more than they did not the long ago for the same watch.
As such, Seiko is not what it used to be especially in terms of value IMHO.
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Re: automatic/mechanical watches on a budget.
Yep, I would have to go secondhand. Probably in either case, actually. Elsewhere I have heard the jump from 100m to 200 makes a difference in how hardy they wind up being. It sounds like that's not the case past 200? Or in general not necessarily the case? Practically, yes, anyway, I will probably never do anything but skin diving or go to the swimming hole.
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Re: automatic/mechanical watches on a budget.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
zambenini
...I have heard the jump from 100m to 200 makes a difference in how hardy they wind up being...
With 100m and under you often have a "Push/Pull" crown.
With 200m and over you often have a "Screw Down" crown.
That is the big difference in water "resistance".
I have heard that 100m is fine for showering, washing dishes, swimming in a pool, and the like but once you start "diving" you really want 200m.
After that it starts getting expensive with thicker crystals, thicker cases, better seals all around, and helium escape valves. Like most things, diminishing returns at exponentially more cost.
Again, think bike parts/groups:
80% should be good with Shimano 105 (i.e. 100m watch)
19% should be good with Shimano Ultegra (true enthusiasts)(i.e. 200m watch)
01% need Dura-Ace (becasue they actually race so weight and minuscule performance improvements matter) (i.e. 500m or more watch)
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Re: automatic/mechanical watches on a budget.
i used to have a watch that turned into a robot. i'm really glad that those haven't come back in to style.
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Re: automatic/mechanical watches on a budget.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
jerk
i used to have a watch that turned into a robot. i'm really glad that those haven't come back in to style.
I had a watch you could play space invaders on. Not trying to steal your thunder just stating a fact.
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1 Attachment(s)
Re: automatic/mechanical watches on a budget.
It's impossible to watch the Tour de France and not see thousands of TISSOT signs so I gave them a look. I liked what I saw and I've ordered a Le Locle Powermatic 80
Attachment 112601
I threw a Seiko series 5 gold watch with black dial onto the order while I was at it.
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1 Attachment(s)
Re: automatic/mechanical watches on a budget.
My watches came in and they look great! The Tissot looks very sharp; I like the white dial with the dimples. The Seiko bracelet feels a bit cheap but the watch cost $85 so I'm not complaining.
Attachment 112623
Grumpy Cat approves
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Re: automatic/mechanical watches on a budget.
It is not worth modding Seiko watches (whether you do it yourself or not) IMHO.
Seiko SKX011
-Mod 1
239 Stock SKX011
85 Double Domed sapphire crystal and install
60 Ceramic lumed bezel insert and install
50 Seiko silicone rubber strap
- Mod 2
95 Seiko NH36 movement and install (hacks and hand winds)
25 Dagaz black hands and install
39 Seiko SARB059 crown/stem and install (needed for movement upgrade)
$593 Total
I probably could have saved some money on labor if all mods were done by the same person at the same time. I really like the final outcome but almost $600 is a great deal of money to spend on a Seiko when for a little less I could have had a Squale or Steinhart with a better movement, better parts, and better overall finishing. The only difference, the Seiko is customized for me.
Seiko SNZH57 (Fifty Five Fathoms)
150 Stock SNZH57
50 Double domed sapphire crystal
30 Dagaz FFF dial
50 Seiko NH35 movement (hacks and hand winds)
25 MKS sailcloth strap
90 Labor
$395 Total
I really like this one as well. Could have had a Hamilton Khaki Field with better movement, better parts, and better finishing for about the same money but it would not look like a Blancpain Fifty Fathoms "homage".
After image
Attachment 112649
Attachment 112650Attachment 112651
Before images:
https://cdn.creationwatches.com/prod...ZH57J1_LRG.jpghttps://cdn.creationwatches.com/prod...X011J1_LRG.jpg
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Re: automatic/mechanical watches on a budget.
If you like it, then it's good. I've poured lots of money into fixing up old bikes with no hope of ever getting it back but it was what I felt needed to be done so no regrets.
I like your mods; they are definite improvements in my opinion.
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Re: automatic/mechanical watches on a budget.
Ok, that Blancpain wannabe is worth it. I am not wild about orange dials so no comment on the worthwhileness of the other but the 55 is tres cool.
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Re: automatic/mechanical watches on a budget.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
zambenini
Ok, that Blancpain wannabe is worth it. I am not wild about orange dials so no comment on the worthwhileness of the other but the 55 is tres cool.
I always wanted an orange dial diver.
And these are the other two FFF for my brothers.
Attachment 112654Attachment 112655
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Re: automatic/mechanical watches on a budget.
Had the opportunity to try one of these on while on vacation in Amsterdam about 2 weeks ago. The watch wears much smaller than I would have thought and the bracelet felt really cheap. The metal bracelet should be on a $320 Seiko and not a $3200 Grand Seiko. I really wanted to like it but the bracelet was so bad I passed on buying even though they can be difficult to find.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
NYCfixie
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Re: automatic/mechanical watches on a budget.
What are your thoughts on Folex (aka Faux-lex) watches?
What about "homage" watches in general no matter what brand they are trying to copy/homage?
Does it matter if it is a cheap less than $100 Chinese model from AliExpress (as is the one shown below that my younger brother got for me as a funny gift)?
What about if it is a more expensive homage such as a Sqaule at $575, a Steinhart at $500, or even a Ginault at $1300?
(apparently the Ginalut is a frighteningly good Submariner copy even at the $1300 price)
https://ae01.alicdn.com/kf/HTB10Da_a...cq6zzSXXab.jpg
http://www.gnomonwatches.com/image/d...micClassic.jpghttp://www.gnomonwatches.com/image/d...OCEANone39.jpghttps://www.themodestman.com/wp-cont...ver-review.jpg
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Re: automatic/mechanical watches on a budget.
The SKX is dead, long live the SKX...
(I probably should have not just sold my heavily modded SKX011 but at least it went to a good home)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5alFPHdP12Q
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Re: automatic/mechanical watches on a budget.
I am having serious seller's remorse and possibly more so because SKX007/009/011 prices are already going up.
If you just sold a watch because you really were not wearing it, would you buy it again (and mod it again) if you thought it might not be around in the future?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
NYCfixie
It is not worth modding Seiko watches (whether you do it yourself or not) IMHO.
Seiko SKX011
-Mod 1
239 Stock SKX011
85 Double Domed sapphire crystal and install
60 Ceramic lumed bezel insert and install
50 Seiko silicone rubber strap
- Mod 2
95 Seiko NH36 movement and install (hacks and hand winds)
25 Dagaz black hands and install
39 Seiko SARB059 crown/stem and install (needed for movement upgrade)
$593 Total
Attachment 112651Attachment 112649
Quote:
Originally Posted by
NYCfixie
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Re: automatic/mechanical watches on a budget.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
NYCfixie
I am having serious seller's remorse and possibly more so because SKX007/009/011 prices are already going up.
If you just sold a watch because you really were not wearing it, would you buy it again (and mod it again) if you thought it might not be around in the future?
Nope. I'd only buy a watch I planned on wearing.
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Re: automatic/mechanical watches on a budget.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
NYCfixie
I am having serious seller's remorse and possibly more so because SKX007/009/011 prices are already going up.
If you just sold a watch because you really were not wearing it, would you buy it again (and mod it again) if you thought it might not be around in the future?
Nope. Same with bikes - remember that you sold it for a reason. Look forward, not backward.
Also, the SKX is a good value proposition, but if you're going to pour some money into it, just buy the watch you really want instead. At $200-250 it's a good watch, but for $350 or more I'd start looking at the Samurai, etc.
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Re: automatic/mechanical watches on a budget.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Matthew Strongin
Nope. I'd only buy a watch I planned on wearing.
What he said. Rock it, don't stock it.
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Re: automatic/mechanical watches on a budget.
I had three Seiko 5 SNZH55/57 "Fifty Five Fathoms" watches made for me and two of my brothers several weeks ago as an homage to the Blancpain Fifty Fathoms.
It is interesting to see what each of us chose:
Oldest = gold dial and hands, sailcloth strap
Attachment 113124
Second oldest (me) = silver dial and hands with date at 4:30, two piece nylon bond style strap
Attachment 113125
Third oldest = silver dial and hands with date at 3, original Seiko bracelet
Attachment 113126
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Re: automatic/mechanical watches on a budget.
Against my better judgement because I am trying to downsize my watch collection (because I do not actually want a collection), I ordered this just announced ISLANDER AUTOMATIC DIVE WATCH (SKX clone) from Long Island Watch; it is their new in-house brand.
https://cdn3.volusion.com/htlyr.vuqk...jpg?1569067571
I recently sold my Spinnaker Tesei Titanium, Seiko SRP777, modded Seiko SKX011, never worn Hamtun Nanok, and barely worn Casio DW5035 35th Anniversary but still wanted a beater watch.
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Re: automatic/mechanical watches on a budget.
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Re: automatic/mechanical watches on a budget.
How about a fun exercise on a rainy, cold, and dreary New England afternoon....dreaming of warmer and sunnier days on the bike with one of these on the wrist....
Which one would you purchase new and why?
(assuming no wait lists and prices were the same)
Would you go for the classic style of the Submariner Date stainless steel or the quirky Pelagos LHD titanium ("fauxtina" lume, roulette date wheel, and LHD compared to the regular Pelagos)?
Has the Submariner and Submariner Date become "luxury timepieces" whereas the Pelagos and Pelagos LHD could still be considered "tool watches"?
Rolex Submariner Date 116610LN $8550
https://images.rolex.com/2019/catalo...610ln-0001.png
Tudor Pelagos LHD 25610TNL (Left Hand Drive) $4450
https://www.tudorwatch.com/statics/i...10tnl-0001.png
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Re: automatic/mechanical watches on a budget.
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Re: automatic/mechanical watches on a budget.
Sub, because it's a better watch, especially if you're (hypothetically) setting the prices the same. I'm equally a fan of both brands and love the Pelagos, fwiw. It's just that the Sub is better in every way, which is also why it's twice the price. The only caveat is that if you're going to ride your bike with it on, the Pelagos is the right choice because it's Ti. Bonus points for getting one anodized to match your Ti bike.
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Re: automatic/mechanical watches on a budget.
realized I put this in the wrong thread as both watchesshould not be considered "...on a budget" unless your thing is Richard Mille. Please carry-on anyway...
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Re: automatic/mechanical watches on a budget.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
NYCfixie
realized I put this in the wrong thread as both watchesshould not be considered "...on a budget" unless your thing is
Richard Mille. Please carry-on anyway...
Not that you implied anything, but I feel it necessary to record for posterity that Richard Mille is most definitely not "my thing."
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Re: automatic/mechanical watches on a budget.
Reasons for the pelagos just to make this a total crossfire episode:
-- first titanium case from Rolex/Tudor
-- first (I believe) in house Tudor movement with a silicon balance spring that rolex hasn't adopted.
-- that new Rolex submariner case decided to make the lugs fatty mc fatties for no real reason.
-- the spring microadjust on the bracelet is better than the glidelock.
Also destro watches are fun, the helium escape valve breaks up the slab side of the case and the fauxtina is subtle to more of a cream look than anything else.
But if you want to make your money back on buying, Rolex is the way to go.
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Re: automatic/mechanical watches on a budget.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Matthew Strongin
Not that you implied anything, but I feel it necessary to record for posterity that Richard Mille is most definitely not "my thing."
was not directed at you....just a general tongue-in-cheek comment.
can you move these posts to the "timepieces thread"?
(assuming it is not too much trouble)
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Re: automatic/mechanical watches on a budget.
Of those two, the Tudor hands down. It's a much more interesting watch IMO.
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Re: automatic/mechanical watches on a budget.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
choke
Of those two, the Tudor hands down. It's a much more interesting watch IMO.
In general I agree, but I just can't get over the "snowflake" hour hand. And the sword minute hand is totally "meh."
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Re: automatic/mechanical watches on a budget.
I personally would find a NOS '2-liner' Pelagos sitting in an AD. I believe the Sub to be a better watch but I couldn't wear one.
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Re: automatic/mechanical watches on a budget.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Jason Musgrave
I personally would find a NOS '2-liner' Pelagos sitting in an AD. I believe the Sub to be a better watch but I couldn't wear one.
Because ETA versus in-house movement? Less writing on dial? something else?
And why no Sub?
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Re: automatic/mechanical watches on a budget.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
theflashunc
Reasons for the pelagos just to make this a total crossfire episode:
-- first titanium case from Rolex/Tudor
-- first (I believe) in house Tudor movement with a silicon balance spring that rolex hasn't adopted.
-- that new Rolex submariner case decided to make the lugs fatty mc fatties for no real reason.
-- the spring microadjust on the bracelet is better than the glidelock.
Also destro watches are fun, the helium escape valve breaks up the slab side of the case and the fauxtina is subtle to more of a cream look than anything else.
But if you want to make your money back on buying, Rolex is the way to go.
In the spirit of crossfire, you're wrong! (Well, kinda.)
Rolex has adopted silicon for some models, though not the Sub. The Sub uses Parachrom and I'd say there are pros and cons to each, though either way you're getting quality. I agree the titanium is awesome, as is the "fauxtina," and that the maxi lugs Rolex moved to take some getting used to (I like them, but totally get that not everybody does). But Glidelock is the shit. Totally awesome. The Tudor micro adjust is cool too, but I'm amazed by Glidelock every time I touch it.
Honestly, though, despite both being dive watches, these two are actually pretty different in the "flesh." The best way to decide is to try them both on, see which one you like better, and then buy both.
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Re: automatic/mechanical watches on a budget.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Matthew Strongin
...The best way to decide is to try them both on, see which one you like better, and then buy both.
That is the outcome my wife (not me) is trying to avoid.
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Re: automatic/mechanical watches on a budget.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Matthew Strongin
Honestly, though, despite both being dive watches, these two are actually pretty different in the "flesh." The best way to decide is to try them both on, see which one you like better, and then buy both.
This is naturally the best answer. Part with whichever Rolex you're wearing the least for a healthy profit, and buy both.
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Re: automatic/mechanical watches on a budget.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
theflashunc
...Part with whichever Rolex you're wearing the least for a healthy profit...
I think there is a great deal of hype in the Rolex market and individuals are not actually making any money (having talked to several online and especially brick and mortar shops who I have known for many years and trust). Authorized Dealers are making about 40% profit on that initial watch sale but that is nothing new. Some of the Pre-Owned dealers are making money on in-demand watches (Daytona, GMT, Submariner) but they are assuming all the risk holding stock waiting for buyers to pay a premium for watches they cannot get (because they do not have an existing relationship with an AD so at best they will be on a list for several years if they really want the watch and refuse to pay the premium).
Submariner Date
Retail Cost: $9148.50 = $8550 Retail + $598.50 (7% sales tax - average)
Pre-owned sell price: $11500.00 = Highest legitimate pre-owned selling price I could find
Pre-owned buy price: $8625 = 11500.00 * 75% (most online and brick and mortar retailers need at least 25% mark up)
* Best case is an individual can almost get back the retail price of a Submariner Date assuming it is in like-new condition with box and papers
GMT Master II
Retail Cost: $9897.50 = $9250 Retail + $647.50 (7% sales tax - average)
Pre-owned sell price: $17950.00 = Highest legitimate pre-owned selling price I could find
Pre-owned buy price: $13,462.50 = 17950.00 * 75% (most online and brick and mortar retailers need at least 25% mark up)
* Best case is an individual might make a few thousand dollars if they get a GMT Master II and immediately flip it but why do that if you actually get one?
I did not bother with the Daytona because most people have a better chance of getting struck by lightning twice than actually getting the opportunity to buy a stainless steel Daytona at retail. It is probably the same for the GMT Master II but I did that option anyway for purposes of explaining the current Rolex market (ATMO).
One could take on all the risk and sell a Submariner to another individual but that has its own problems. Are you going to accept $10,000 (nobody is going to give you $11,500 for it because at least stores come with a guarantee; individual sales do not) via PayPal and eat the $300 PayPal fee? Do you think a buyer is going to wire you $10,000 and assume all the risk?
After doing lots of research and having sold an in-demand 16570 Explorer II Polar earlier this year that I owned for 25 years from new, individuals are not making "healthy profits" on Rolex watches. The exception is if you have a GMT or Daytona from the earliest years that has been in your family since new, is in very good condition, has not been over polished, comes with box and papers, and still runs. Other than that, best case is you might get your money out of an in-demand watch like the Submariner or Explorer II Polar but for other models hope to not take as big a loss as with other brands (Patek excluded from that statement).
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Re: automatic/mechanical watches on a budget.
Rolex has done an excellent job marketing, they are robust but not terrific pieces of horological engineering. For about a third of the price of eg what someone will sell you their place in the queue for a daytona you can get a unique piece from an independent maker, and support Innovation and personal craftsmanship. It is not about money it is about skill and art. Regards.