Ukraine

[Philster]

From what I’ve learned about history, WWI and WWII were actually a continuation of the same conflict. In fact, you’ll struggle to find any discreet historical moments to apply to current events. What matters is the present and future. What’s happening is a likely madman is killing innocents. I couldn’t give a sh*t about Russian history.

[theflashunc]

From what I’ve learned about history, WWI and WWII were actually a continuation of the same conflict. In fact, you’ll struggle to find any discreet historical moments to apply to current events. What matters is the present and future. What’s happening is a likely madman is killing innocents. I couldn’t give a sh*t about Russian history.

Cool.

[choke]

Noam Chomsky on Ukraine in 2015.

[jclay]

what we may have had for the last century is just two large interregnums in one on-going dispute amongst the Great Powers in Europe.

It ain't just amongst the GP's in Europe; the USA has been busy as a beaver in that game.

but it's the same bullshit over sphere's of influence.

Do I hear quacking (looks down and sees webbed footprint in a pile of duck crap)?

Sometimes after reading current affairs articles I'll push the chair back and just chuckle at us; its a gallows chuckle for sure. Humans really are going to ball this planet up. Be it via overt war or over population & over consumption, ecosystem damage/destruction or some combination of those or others I don't know; but how humanity can't see hwhere we're headed baffles me no end.

Cataclysmic war is never terribly far away (be it via evil, national pride or fuckup) and the environmental/ecosystem/flora/fauna destruction we've been heaping on this heat engine named Earth is mind boggling and with nothing resembling an adequate course correction. It will likely not end well.

Here's another presentation, link courtesy of my Italian brother. I'm just rolling it now but I'll post the link anyway.

[theflashunc]

It ain't just amongst the GP's in Europe; the USA has been busy as a beaver in that game.



Do I hear quacking (looks down and sees webbed footprint in a pile of duck crap)?

Sometimes after reading current affairs articles I'll push the chair back and just chuckle at us; its a gallows chuckle for sure. Humans really are going to ball this planet up. Be it via overt war or over population & over consumption, ecosystem damage/destruction or some combination of those or others I don't know; but how humanity can't see hwhere we're headed baffles me no end.

Cataclysmic war is never terribly far away (be it via evil, national pride or fuckup) and the environmental/ecosystem/flora/fauna destruction we've been heaping on this heat engine named Earth is mind boggling and with nothing resembling an adequate course correction. It will likely not end well.

Here's another presentation, link courtesy of my Italian brother. I'm just rolling it now but I'll post the link anyway.

Apologies, 100% implied US was in that Great Powers discussion. Despite our reluctance to enter WWI and WWII, we're absolutely part of that equation and the post-WWII order on the continent.

Bretton Woods happened here after all.

[gregl]

...who in their right mind would want US style "democracy" to win this game by being the last player on the board?

You're making a big assumption here. I fully acknowledge that the US system of democracy is broken, possibly irreparably. Until gerrymandering and campaign finance are fixed/repaired/blown up, I have little hope for the US system and certainly don't advocate exporting it. At the same time, the hand wringing and constant rehashing of US history isn't helping people in Ukraine who are dying at Putin's direction. We should remember and acknowledge the role of US foreign policy in creating today's world problems. We should address the structural problems in US government that are continuing to cause problems today. But we should absolutely not provide excuses for Putin's current war crimes.

Greg

[Will Neide]

But we should absolutely not provide excuses for Putin's current war crimes.

Greg

Lots of this.

Although, I'm inclined to disagree with the notion that the US system is broken. Bent maybe. Certainly in need of course adjustments, but we imported it (Roman Republic) ourselves with our own tweaks.

[classtimesailer]

A focus on Putin leaves the US to continue its domination. American democracy is not broken. It is functioning as designed.

[vertical_doug]

Putin realizes if the West intervenes militarily he loses. This is why he must start threatening the nuclear card. This is clear.

[bcm119]

As several historians and analysts smarter than me have pointed out, his claims aren't Soviet. They are Tsarist. He's been open about the notion that Lenin gave away portions of what he views as territories and peoples under the Russian umbrella.

He may be a product of the Cold War, but his views of the legacy of the Russian state are all pre-Soviet Revolution.

I've been reading the same analyses, also by people much smarter than me. And they make a lot of sense. And I think the idea that history and pride are major drivers of Putin's goals are really hard for many Americans to understand. Especially in that weird wrap-around zone of American politics -- the faction quick to blame US foreign policy and reluctant to admit the role of Ukrainian free will in this war. This isn't a gotcha moment for the sins of the neocons, as many sins as they did commit. It's a tragedy and people are suffering as we speak, and I'm disappointed in those who claim to be on the side of humanity using this as a soap box opportunity to draw moral equivalencies where there are none.

[vertical_doug]

On Monday March 7, two large Russian Corporate Bonds mature- Rosneft and Gasprom. Both companies have the funds to pay the bonds, but Putin has said companies cannot remit foreign exchange. In the Gasprom case, the cash funds should already be ringed fenced in a special finance vehicle. If the companies fail to pay, the cross bond defaults for all their debt will be triggered. This will get even more dire for Russian finances.

[bigbill]

This is a good series of tweets from Abraham Newman (Georgetown) on the financial situation in Russia.

https://twitter.com/ANewman_forward/...01848939343876

[rabo]

What we learn from history is that we can not learn from history.

[jimcav]

oh man, let us not debate if indiscriminate vs inexplicable and unconscionable , but is there any other verification of the CNN report that they shelled Zaporizhzhia nuclear power plant and it is now on fire!!

[echappist]

oh man, let us not debate if indiscriminate vs inexplicable and unconscionable , but is there any other verification of the CNN report that they shelled Zaporizhzhia nuclear power plant and it is now on fire!!

How should this be interpreted? Putin's way of saying "let us win or else you all (Ukraine and the rest of Europe) get the nuclear fall out"? This is getting more death cult-like than one could have imagined...

[thollandpe]

oh man, let us not debate if indiscriminate vs inexplicable and unconscionable , but is there any other verification of the CNN report that they shelled Zaporizhzhia nuclear power plant and it is now on fire!!

Reuters and the Jerusalem Post.
Europe's largest nuclear power plant on fire after Russian attack, says local mayor — Reuters
Russian forces open fire, attack nuclear plant in Zaporizhzhia — JPost

“When someone shows you who they are, believe them the first time.” — Maya Angelou

[gregl]

How should this be interpreted? Putin's way of saying "let us win or else you all (Ukraine and the rest of Europe) get the nuclear fall out"? This is getting more death cult-like than one could have imagined...

It can also be attributed to the fog of war. It’s possible we’ll never know why this atrocity took place. If it is a deliberate act, done at Putin’s direction or with his approval, it either represents madness or animal cunning. The fallout will eventually drift over Russian territory. Putin could claim that the Ukrainians deliberately destroyed the facility to spread fallout on Russia. We’re all trying to make sense of a war in progress. That just isn’t possible.

Greg

[jimcav]

My best interpretation would be that they are strategically taking out power supplied by that plant. Hopefully with enough competence to not involve the radioactive areas. Obviously that targets the civilian population. There seems very little regard for international laws and agreements on warfare.

One of the 1st times I ran afoul of superiors in the military was marching and one of the stupid lines in the cadence had the phrase "napalm sticks to kids". It was July 1988, and I refused to repeat it back. I much prefer those that tap into patriotic duty, "pin my medal on my chest, tell my mom I did my best" versus explicitly glorifying the horror of war.

I haven't been able to jog recently with a latest round of post-covid heart rate issues, but sometimes those old cadences used to pop up in my head and help me slog up a hill.

Well, I guess I'm rambling, but just really hope there are more-often-than-not instances where those with weapons choose not to do the worst.

Hope they all know the poem 'Dulce et Decorum est'

[Will Neide]

The world is a tinderbox right now. If the world does nothing, and Russia follows through with this war, Ukraine is snuffed out. The Ukrainians will fight to the death and they have no desire to be under Yanukovych and Russian rule again. If anyone does step in, WWIII? What does China do?

[monadnocky]

...What does China do?

They patiently observe, likely seeing how the current crisis unfolds vis-a-vis any intention they have of taking Taiwan - and the greater South China Sea - by force.