visually proper bikes

[stewie]

I agree, I think the traditional bars (the ends) are supposed to point towards the rear brakes to give a relaxed wrist position when in the drops.
I prefer the round bars, but I have this semi traditional (Ritchey Evolution) on this bike, works well though:

Attachment 25393

someone here's gonna tell you it is not "visually proper" because it does not have tubs on it.

very 'modern' looking.

[Len J]

A few quick comments after reading this thread.

The title is "Visully" proper bikes. To me that speaks to what looks good.

What looks good to me is a matter of opinion....kinda hard to debate.

3 things that jarred my eye in the bikes presented

1.) Non-setback seatposts.......my first thought is "Not fit correctly"....didn't say it was right, just my first thought (Hence the visually jarring)

2.) Anotomic bars....especially set up at weird angles.

3.) This one will probably get me crushed, but the straight blade steel fork tongs on the white Zank......they immediatly caught my eye and not in a good way.

Since I took the liberty to have an opinion, the least I could do was present my bike for abuse. (The spacers on top of the stem have been reduced BTW...older pic)

Len

[ineff]

A few quick comments after reading this thread.

The title is "Visully" proper bikes. To me that speaks to what looks good.

What looks good to me is a matter of opinion....kinda hard to debate.

3 things that jarred my eye in the bikes presented

1.) Non-setback seatposts.......my first thought is "Not fit correctly"....didn't say it was right, just my first thought (Hence the visually jarring)

2.) Anotomic bars....especially set up at weird angles.

3.) This one will probably get me crushed, but the straight blade steel fork tongs on the white Zank......they immediatly caught my eye and not in a good way.

Since I took the liberty to have an opinion, the least I could do was present my bike for abuse. (The spacers on top of the stem have been reduced BTW...older pic)

Len

I agree with everything but the straight blade fork, I've always liked the look of straight legs.

Two things on your (amazing) Sachs, a stem that matches the TT angle, and non-colored tires. other than that...

[WFSTEKL]

Bars are too high, cassette is too big, and clinchers?

Only kidding. Nice machine!

[AntLockyer]

I agree on the straight fork thing. Hence me getting curved on my Hampsten. Ineff I much prefer an ahead stem to not match the top tube angle. Threaded has to match.

[Len J]

Bars are too high, cassette is too big, and clinchers?

Only kidding. Nice machine!

LOL

I'm 55 YO.....
It's a 12-23
I gave up tubbies long time ago....not worth the hassle for the ever decreasing gain (to me)
I rode that bike 5K miles this year.

[giordana93]

this is such an old notion that it's almost not worth pointing out, but note the parallel drops on these classic shots posted above. short answer: today the hoods are the default cruising position and lots of people clamor for having the whole line of tops to hoods parallel (so they have to tilt classic bars up); when the drops were the default position (low & aero and closer to the shifter on the DT), they were generally flat or slightly tilted, 2-3 degrees, but not pointing even at the rear dropouts. torso, top tube, and arm length, along with saddle to bar drop, influence what is comfortable.. anatomic bars tried to address this, while also getting back something that was lost when we went to the higher hoods--the ability to have a nice grab of the brakes while in the drops without having to angle your arms in an uncomfortable (unsustainable on long descents) way
it was also of course a lot of marketing hype

Merckx on a Colnago, Gimondi on a Bianchi, etc., etc. That's proper....

finally, I almost posted yesterday that Stonewall was the only thing one could call a gay bar, but decided to just let the fire go out, but then this was in the news.

so when we say gay bars mean the thread is done, or should be excluded from what is proper, it might be ok in a private sphere, but this is a public forum. and spelling it ghey doesn't change that. atmo

[Len J]

I agree with everything but the straight blade fork, I've always liked the look of straight legs.

Two things on your (amazing) Sachs, a stem that matches the TT angle, and non-colored tires. other than that...

I like some straight blade forks, but I've never met a straight bladed steel fork that looked good to me. nice having choices though.

Stem angle was a comprimise.......I'm old and wanted to ride the bike for a long time.

red tires........I didn't like them when I first got the bike, but they grew on me.

Len

[red]

even gay guys can laugh at "ghey bars" ; )

Y'all are taking things way too seriously. Besides, we wouldn't have to keep using the term if you didn't keep postin' the friggin things!

[endo shi]

the least I could do was present my bike for abuse.
Len

Get some Challenge gumwalls and you're money. That bike is very close.

[endo shi]

a stem that matches the TT angle

I see this said a lot and I disagree.

For any normal, good stem, 82-84 (-8 to -6) degrees is as flat as it gets. If you wanted a TT to match an 84 degree stem, then you'd need an 11 degree TT slope. That's significant, and most would argue that that TT slope is not visually proper. 73 degree stems may have made sense in the quill stem era, but with modern low-stack headsets and little-to-no spacers an 84 deg stem on a 0 deg TT looks fine and proper.

[Jas0n]

You must not ride very long or low bikes. I love to run my round bend bars angled up. I also like to have the bike long and low with my hoods nice and hi! I usually like to have the ends of the bars pointing toward the dropouts. I think this is a great way to set up a race bike.

I don't think its a matter of my position as much as its an indicator that the particular set-up we're talking about doesn't agree with the traditional way a round bar was set-up. To each his own, of course - but deep drop bars are designed so that the drops are run parallel (or very slightly north of parallel) to the ground. When I see drops that are pointing upwards noticeably, to me its sign that the rider wants to be more comfortable on the tops, a position these bars aren't really designed to accommodate as well/often as the drops. I get the same impression when I see riders move the levers further up on traditional bars. This is, I think, a large part of why anatomic bars came about.

[Jas0n]

this is such an old notion that it's almost not worth pointing out, but note the parallel drops on these classic shots posted above. short answer: today the hoods are the default cruising position and lots of people clamor for having the whole line of tops to hoods parallel (so they have to tilt classic bars up); when the drops were the default position (low & aero and closer to the shifter on the DT), they were generally flat or slightly tilted, 2-3 degrees, but not pointing even at the rear dropouts. torso, top tube, and arm length, along with saddle to bar drop, influence what is comfortable.. anatomic bars tried to address this, while also getting back something that was lost when we went to the higher hoods ...

This. I should just delete my previous post.

[mimbresman]

Got to throw this one out. This is my road ride, my 1992 Bridgestone RB-2 (56cm). This is the last bike I've bought new. I like it. Pretty much stock except for the tires, and I think the cassette (7-speed) was swapped out from a 23 big cog to a 26 for riding in the Gila. Again in storage in NM so I don't get to ride it much, even when I am there since I spend most of my time riding offroad. When I do ride it, I enjoy it. It handles nice and has a smooth ride. A good bike for the "inner loop" for those of you familiar with the Gila. Again as far as bikes go, it is nothing super fancy. As far as the finish, I don't like the cheesy tape stripes on the finish. I'm missing a "2" on the RB-2 decal. I am really looking at the geometry and the set-up. I like the simplicity of downtube shifters and I like the nice fork. The pedals are first generation Shimano SPDs. I'm a bit embarrassed by the greasy front hub.

[WFSTEKL]

LOL

I'm 55 YO.....
It's a 12-23
I gave up tubbies long time ago....not worth the hassle for the ever decreasing gain (to me)
I rode that bike 5K miles this year.

Good for you, Len. It's a great machine.

[suspectdevice]

Golden Ratios:
A few proper hardtail race bikes.

Jeremy Powers.

Jeremy's CX bike which I based the numbers on

By Luxe for someone who ain't all that tall.


650b race/trail bike for Matt Green

26" race bike for Matt Green


Different applications require bikes that look differently. Contact points are scaled and modified across intended use, effectively they are the same from a road bike to an XC race bike. Bar width and weight distribution contribute to those changes. Most people run their MTB's with stems that are too short, bars that are too high and suspension that is too soft.

[jsrieck]

Contact points are scaled and modified across intended use, effectively they are the same from a road bike to an XC race bike. Bar width and weight distribution contribute to those changes. Most people run their MTB's with stems that are too short, bars that are too high and suspension that is too soft.

When you are transferring contact points between drop bar and flat bar bikes, how do you interpret reach? Do you use the hoods or the handlebars? Sorry for the shameless thread jack....

[merlinago]

i've gotten mixed reviews on the color splash on this one, but i have to say orange/ti is one of the most visually pleasing combinations i've ever put together. atmo?

[mimbresman]

^^^sweet^^^

[giordana93]

Different applications require bikes that look differently. Contact points are scaled and modified across intended use, effectively they are the same from a road bike to an XC race bike. Bar width and weight distribution contribute to those changes. Most people run their MTB's with stems that are too short, bars that are too high and suspension that is too soft.

but do "most people" intend to do XC racing (in which case the blanket statement might be right) and/or short track type riding? anyone who has ever been on a steep technical trail with a really long and low bar that drops even more with a front shock knows that an endo is more likely, or, when climbing, it is harder to keep enough weight over the rear wheel when the stem is too long and low, which just goes to prove your first statement--that different applications require different set-up. interesting that one of your photos has a bar that looks almost above the seat and another has a relatively short stem, esp. given the saddle to stem drop. they don't appear "visually proper" to my eye (though the last pic does for the most part)