Llewellyn Bikes

[CarbonNeutral]

Lookin' good Dazza.

Surprised you didn't opt for a Paragon T47 bottom bracket.

[Dazza]

The client's desires are also a factor in choice.

A friend of mine said to me

"Threaded BB shells, silly idea, it will never catch on"

Lookin' good Dazza.

Surprised you didn't opt for a Paragon T47 bottom bracket.

[Dazza]

3 March 2016
Then it was time to cook the frame set up. Clean all joints, now this takes more time than many would care to think it does. Check all the fits with a fresh eye and file touch here and there is required. Load the tubes into the jig all fluxed up. Tack and then remove to the inspection table. I don’t take many pictures of brazing and such like (however in other albums there are plenty) because I keep on task and concentrate. A false move, a wee mistake can be fatal to good alignment or even destroy the materials, either of which is a depressing thought. When one puts a lot of detail content into a frame set it can mean many days of work going belly up if a mistake is made, a wee bit less tragic for builders of frames with less labour content but none the less, for any builder a stuff up is a big heart ache and many days of $ earning and materials can be lost. Oh, yeah, I have been there too often!
The braze up went as expected, large thin tubes that exceed the 30 to 1 ration of diameter to wall by a long way distort a fair bit. Now I in all genuine frankness, my maximum tolerance for HT to ST tolerance is a total of .30mm from one end of the HT alignment rod to the other end. That is .30mm (.012”) over a span of 400mm. (15 ½”) Not many builder’s speak of tolerances, because they don’t have any or don’t care. From HT to Dropout face is also .30mm.



One cannot do any cold setting of a main frame triangle with such large thin tubes, the frame will crumple before it yields. Meaning, grunt it back into alignment. However I had anticipated this and I have machined the head set alignment inserts with .15mm eccentricity. I fit them and rotate them inside the head tube till the fork axis (alignment rod) is inside the tolerance. I aimed at .10mm., then brazed them in permanently and the end result was .15mm. Happy chappie am I ! After I brazed the main triangle I did some fillet finishing work because it easier and safer to do before the stays are added.




More jigs had to be made to fit around the big tubes. This takes a day here and day there, first to think it out and then make the thingies! Simple lathe and mill work. One such item is this jiggy to do the DT braze on bosses.







This little boss was the first part I designed by 3D CAD ten years ago. This Llewellyn part is used by many builders around the world since then. Naturally for me it is cast in stainless steel to avoid corrosion from battery acid perspiration.

[Dazza]

[Mark Kelly]

One cannot do any cold setting of a main frame triangle with such large thin tubes, the frame will crumple before it yields. Meaning, grunt it back into alignment. However I had anticipated this and I have machined the head set alignment inserts with .15mm eccentricity. I fit them and rotate them inside the head tube till the fork axis (alignment rod) is inside the tolerance. I aimed at .10mm., then brazed them in permanently and the end result was .15mm.

Dazza

That's such a smart solution to that problem. Serious kudos.

[Dazza]

Standing at the limit of an endless ocean
stranded like a runaway, lost at sea
city on a rainy day down in the harbour

[dashDustin]

holding steady for the seatpost clamp

[Dazza]

Another half day was making the unusual size clamp for the seat tube which is used to hold the frame while the key hole slot is cut with a slitting saw in the little mill.



Bridges are brazed in and all is checked with a 28mm tyre.



A parcel of the first samples of the M5 seat binder boss arrived this week from LongShen in Taiwan.
Shirley and Allan have been in the business of making castings for frame builders for many years and I visited them in 2005 and have a good working relationship with them for over 10 years.








The location holes are drilled for the pins on the bosses



Makes location simple and accurate.





the Kiwis do the UK beat

[Dazza]

Back to some details. I am not a fan of those clear adhesive patches used to try and prevent cable casings rubbing the paint off. Most owners never change these pads until they notice that the casing has rubbed through the plastic patch and chaffed the paint, then it is too late. Might as well leave them off

Or







The fork is not to be forgotten. I am using the Columbus Grammy 1.5” fork to start with.







I am working on ideas for a new fork crown using MAX fork blades for a steel fork option, which I really think would be super, but it is fair way down the path before that might or could eventuate. Funding that one requires some funds……………..

[Dazza]

So all is brazed up and then the final finish work is done







The new front derailleur braze that I did some critical dimension work for a chap in Europe is super. I give it the polish, no paint marring. I like all to be neat and tidy for many years of riding.



More finish work, slow and careful. Takes a lot more time and effort to do this compared to TIG.
Good TIG work requires a lot of skill, but the reason it works well is it is fast and zero finish work. I like fillets for structural reasons and also for the aesthetic, which is well admired.















All is done.





Stay tuned for pics of the painted frame, but that is some weeks away.
Then the full assembly of the bike with DuraAce 9000 and off with this bike to the Bristol Bespoke show.
Oh and yes I am taking orders for this frame to answer the questions put to me of late, but only a limited number each year. About ten each year, I have 5 spots left for this year. Some seem keen and this frame is yet to roll down the road!

[progetto]

I know it's not your doing Dazza but faaark that crown for headset bearing on that Grammy fork looks rough as guts

[Dazza]

I know it's not your doing Dazza but faaark that crown for headset bearing on that Grammy fork looks rough as guts

YEP! A point I am taking up with Columbus. It had lumps of epoxy which I smoothed off and I will fill with epoxy and smooth over. It just the OD of the seat that was rough. I was hoping some one would spot this. Nothing beats a metal crown race seat that is turned to size with single point tool in line with the steering axis. As good as the steering axis can be.
However the world demands it to be lighter, faster to make, cheaper and the details of what is good is lost.
In my perfect world I would want a machined crown race seat, rather than a molded one.

[dogrange]

Dazza,

Beautiful work, thanks for taking the time to document. Punters' questions to follow:

I really like the aesthetic of the large diameter tubes. On the other hand, is this bike likely to be "block of wood" stiff for a normal MAMIL (riding around at say 200-270 watts), or do the thin wall thicknesses provide some flex that might increase the responsive feel for one of weaker wattages?

Similarly, is this significantly heavier than a similar build with something like the PegoRichie tubes?

[Dazza]

Dazza,

Beautiful work, thanks for taking the time to document. Punters' questions to follow:

I really like the aesthetic of the large diameter tubes. On the other hand, is this bike likely to be "block of wood" stiff for a normal MAMIL (riding around at say 200-270 watts), or do the thin wall thicknesses provide some flex that might increase the responsive feel for one of weaker wattages?

Similarly, is this significantly heavier than a similar build with something like the PegoRichie tubes?

I am not a believer that stiffer is faster, less power absorbed from the pedal pressure on its way to twisting the rear hub. If it was so, we could easily make frames as stiff as a block of granite.
However some clients desire or have a strong fetish for STIFF.

There is more material in Colossus than any standard Columbus OS tube set selection. There is more material than XL (DOS) tube sets, there is more tube material than a Columbus MAX tube set. I have used MAX chainstays and 18mm seat stays compared to MAX's squashed 16mm seat stays. The TT of Colossus is 35mm in diameter which is the same size as a MAX and XL DT. It will be stiff. How much flex in the fork blades is the ????
This frame weighs 2020 grams which is the same as a MAX frame set with lugs.
That will be about 200-300 grams more than a OS tube frame set.
The Grammy fork is much lighter than a steel fork for the OS frame, by about 300 to 400 grams so all up gross it will be on par with an OS or XL frame set.
I built Dr Brian a Crescendo XL frame set 10 years ago. That lugged frame with bigger tubes than OS was 1780 grams.
His Colossus prototype weighs in at 2050 grams with a 1.5" Grammy fork @ 310 grams
A OS lugged frame is typically 1750-1850 grams with a 1" steel fork at 650 to 750 grams
so in all, the same! (because of the light fork)

If I or others were to do a steel fork I have no idea of the weight, might be 800 grams.


For some good stuff, go here for a read

http://www.velocipedesalon.com/forum...ize-21480.html

[devlin]

I can attest that the frame in ones hands feels quite substantial. Makes picking up the XL frame I just finish feel 'skinny'. I have no doubt this bike will be stiffer than just about anything around. I'm on the same page as Dazza with regards to frame stiffness as well. too stiff and the bike looses all positive road feel and feed back.

[Bob Ross]

I am not a fan of those clear adhesive patches used to try and prevent cable casings rubbing the paint off. Most owners never change these pads until they notice that the casing has rubbed through the plastic patch and chaffed the paint, then it is too late. Might as well leave them off

Or

Cot day-um, that is brilliant!

[Todd Mosley]

That boss is BOSS. Are they going to be available to other builders soon?

[Dazza]

That boss is BOSS. Are they going to be available to other builders soon?

Yes, these little fellas will be available some time in May. Note: This M5 boss is for the 33.5mm external butted portion of a 32.7mm seat tube. A 31.60mm seat post fits this tube.

[Gattonero]

I know it's not your doing Dazza but faaark that crown for headset bearing on that Grammy fork looks rough as guts

The Falz has an aluminum cap on the crown which allows for precision machining for alignment of the headset crown race. Some other forks use carbon for this which cannot be machined as precisely and thus can reduce the precision and longevity of the headset....

good ol' Dario.

And I was sure Dazza won't overlook those Grammy forks

[Gattonero]

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That stainless tab is a perfect example of a neat job.
Bravo!