irrational fear of flying

[Mabouya]

Since we're in an introspective mood, this raises the interesting question of how much of a role what you do plays in defining how you think of yourself and how others do. To my neighbors, nearly all of whom I don't know very well, I'm 99% sure that I'm "that guy who rides a bike." To my friends at work, most of whom are also engineers, they presumably don't think of me as just "an engineer." Not sure who they think I am.

[rwsaunders]

You bring your bike? I landed at ORF about 1:45 yesterday, right before the tornado warnings. Riding today I hope.

I wish Jim. I made the drive with my wife and the focus of the weekend was old friends, the wedding and chill time with Mrs. RW. I promise that if I ever get the chance to ride in VA Beach, you will get the call as the ride guide.

[Saab2000]

I wish Jim. I made the drive with my wife and the focus of the weekend was old friends, the wedding and chill time with Mrs. RW. I promise that if I ever get the chance to ride in VA Beach, you will get the call as the ride guide.

I've got bikes and everything you need. Except shorts. I don't share those. Just let me know.

This is a mediocre place to ride a bike, but there are some amazingly fast people here. Bizarre place, for sure. There are better places to ride, but this is where I am, for now.

[Badonkadonk]

saab - totally get your view and will not entreaty you for detailed thoughts.

now, as the instigator of this nonsense, i submit a terrified layperson's aircraft review:

1) 747. obviously the greatest of all time. love the shape, love the presence and link to history, love the width, when these things are done right, oh man what a ride.

2) 757. holy cow can those things GO. full throttle and jiminy christmas you are heading UP.

3) 777. like a more boring, stable, competent little brother to the 747. but those engines are f@$&ing impressive as all get out in every conceivable way.

4) A340. rare here, highest rated airbus on my list. mainly because i'm a sucker for widebodies, classical proportions, and four engines. can be nicely tricked out by some carriers.

5) 737. they keep getting better and better, in small increments. like an ipod. i don't notice them, except for seatback and winglet evolutions, but this aircraft practically defines domestic major carriers to me.

6) L1011 / dc10. i was just a kid, but weren't the stewardesses hotter back then and didnt we get toiletry kits on these? plus, bonus points for eastern airlines L1011s, except the crash-y one(s)

7) dornier regional jet - don't remember the model. got to love the high wing, surprisingly spacious lavatory, and whatever maniac bought one to fly from milwaukee to hartford back in 2004. superior to whatever the fokker is in my book.

8) embraer erj 145 - beats the bombardier crj as to my eye the erj looks sportier, has bigger nacelles and a smaller looking fuselage so just seems more powerful, and due to the cramped cabin and diminished visual space almost always seems cleaner than bigger jets to me.

9) saab 340 turboprops. classic, noisy. prefer in silver skywest livery or united darks.

10) 767. unappealing proportions externally and seating layout. my least favorite boeing. should look like the a340 but for some reason i dont like it as much.

11) a319/320. i'm sure a wonderul airplane. i mean if it's good enough to lamd on the hudson with no power and barely any injuries, it's good. but it just looks to me like a shameless 737 ripoff with potentially inferior flight control systems and too much composite where there should be aluminum. ubiquitous, and for this passenger, forgettable and therefore sinful.

12) prop potpourri including my favorite, the dehavilland beaver on floats, the twin otter, the king air, and so on

13) the md-80. time for this one to go, although i admit the near total silence sitting up front is nice. more than offset by the redeye i flew in that row with no window due to the engine and next to the galley / lav. so basically you get the worst smells and sounds. screw that thing.

14) the ATR. too crash-y.

thats all i've got. havent done a380, dreamliner, a300, and some others. will be interested if others think i have this wrong.
MUCH more fun listing these things down here than riding in them up there!

[holliscx]

Recently flew BCN-EWR solo with two kids under five, almost a 9 hour flight. I took my daughter, 3, for a walk to the back galley and a flight attendant asked me if I wanted wings. I had a vision of blue cheese dressing before I realized she was talking about pilot wings for my daughter's t-shirt. I remember looking forward to getting a deck of cards and wings when I flew as a kid. I haven't seen wings for years but thought it was really cool that United was still giving them to young fliers.

Re: turbulence you were fortunate to be flying an A320 vs a prop plane or lighter aircraft but summer is synonymous with shifty air. I second James's comment about not being in control and an overactive imagination plays a role too.

[GrantM]

Not sure if this story has made the news South of the border or not.
There have been 5 fake bomb threats against West Jet in the past 6 days,
flights diverted, even some people injured during a fast deplaning on the tarmac.
Nobody needs that crap, no need to make people's irrational fear anymore
rational.

WestJet bomb threats likely a 'hoax or a vendetta' against airline, expert says - Calgary - CBC News

-g

[busdriver1959]

Late to the party but here's my two cents. Turbulence isn't much different than waves on a lake. Not many people get worried that a boat will break up and sink every time they hit a wave. No need to worry about that in an airplane. Light turbulence is really good for sleeping (when I'm not up front but back in the bunk).
I've got to disagree with two things Saab has said. First, some pilots are heros. Read up on Express 705. You will also see that a large airplane like a DC-10 can do aerobatics and not fall apart.
A Boeing is an excellent airplane. An Airbus is just an airplane.

[BShow]

Recently flew BCN-EWR solo with two kids under five, almost a 9 hour flight. I took my daughter, 3, for a walk to the back galley and a flight attendant asked me if I wanted wings. I had a vision of blue cheese dressing before I realized she was talking about pilot wings for my daughter's t-shirt. I remember looking forward to getting a deck of cards and wings when I flew as a kid. I haven't seen wings for years but thought it was really cool that United was still giving them to young fliers.

Re: turbulence you were fortunate to be flying an A320 vs a prop plane or lighter aircraft but summer is synonymous with shifty air. I second James's comment about not being in control and an overactive imagination plays a role too.

I dont recall what planes I've been on, but I've been in and out of Newark from Ireland a number of times. I dont think it's ever been a particularly rough flight. Landings have never been memorable. Flying into Philly always seems to be sketchier, probably because the approach is over the mighty delaware river.

The absolute worst flying experience I've had was on a turbo-prop something or other from Roanoke to Philly. The turbulance was bad enough that several people were crying. At one point if felt like we were free falling for a few seconds... it was a bizarre scene. People gasped, then screamed, then cried. I was white knckled the whole flight, and I'm not afraid to fly. I was pretty relieved when we stepped out onto the tarmac that day. That flight sucked.

Another time and I can't remember where, we were in a decent sized jet... the flight was uneventful, but the landing left a mark. We made our approach just fine. I looked out the window to see the people's back yards, the fence, the end of the runway... then out of nowhere, we banked hard left. Just as quickly, we leveled out. It felt like a major correction to be making over the runway we were about to land on and THAT scared the shit out of me. Then we hit the runway, and a friend who was sitting over the wing watched the engine housing flip over the intake of the engine. He screamed, and then started laughing nervously. "I thought we were going down in a heap!" he said.

My wife is absolutely terrified of flying, while I kind of enjoy it.

[Tom]

Hopkins field in Cleveland, corporate King Air was always fun. Out the front window on a windy day was hangar-runway-lake-runway-hangar sequence. The biggest problem on those flights, though, was on the way back home getting the management jamokes up front to slide the cooler with the beer to us in the back.

[Saab2000]

Late to the party but here's my two cents. Turbulence isn't much different than waves on a lake. Not many people get worried that a boat will break up and sink every time they hit a wave. No need to worry about that in an airplane. Light turbulence is really good for sleeping (when I'm not up front but back in the bunk).
I've got to disagree with two things Saab has said. First, some pilots are heros. Read up on Express 705. You will also see that a large airplane like a DC-10 can do aerobatics and not fall apart.
A Boeing is an excellent airplane. An Airbus is just an airplane.

Some pilots are heroes. No doubt about it. But just flying doesn't make me one. I certainly hope I never experience what any of those crews did. It's hair raising stuff.

[Saab2000]

I dont recall what planes I've been on, but I've been in and out of Newark from Ireland a number of times. I dont think it's ever been a particularly rough flight. Landings have never been memorable. Flying into Philly always seems to be sketchier, probably because the approach is over the mighty delaware river.

The absolute worst flying experience I've had was on a turbo-prop something or other from Roanoke to Philly. The turbulance was bad enough that several people were crying. At one point if felt like we were free falling for a few seconds... it was a bizarre scene. People gasped, then screamed, then cried. I was white knckled the whole flight, and I'm not afraid to fly. I was pretty relieved when we stepped out onto the tarmac that day. That flight sucked.

Another time and I can't remember where, we were in a decent sized jet... the flight was uneventful, but the landing left a mark. We made our approach just fine. I looked out the window to see the people's back yards, the fence, the end of the runway... then out of nowhere, we banked hard left. Just as quickly, we leveled out. It felt like a major correction to be making over the runway we were about to land on and THAT scared the shit out of me. Then we hit the runway, and a friend who was sitting over the wing watched the engine housing flip over the intake of the engine. He screamed, and then started laughing nervously. "I thought we were going down in a heap!" he said.

My wife is absolutely terrified of flying, while I kind of enjoy it.

Your quick banking there was likely either a gust of wind or more likely what's known as wake turbulence. Airplane wings leave vortices off the tips and off the flaps when they are extended and if the following airplane flies through that vortex of wind it can turn an airplane pretty hard and fast. It's usually not dangerous but behind a large airplane it could be hazardous.

As to flying into PHL, that's sort of my bread and butter with a huge hub for our partner airline there. Flying over the Delaware River isn't what's tough. The airplane doesn't know it's over a river. But in airplanes like PHL where there's a ton of traffic traffic tends to be spaced very closely together making it a bit more stressful for everyone.

[BShow]

Your quick banking there was likely either a gust of wind or more likely what's known as wake turbulence. Airplane wings leave vortices off the tips and off the flaps when they are extended and if the following airplane flies through that vortex of wind it can turn an airplane pretty hard and fast. It's usually not dangerous but behind a large airplane it could be hazardous.

Thanks for giving some insight on this... I had no idea. I think it was probably a gust of wind. we werent following anything, as we were literally, 3 or 4 seconds from touch down. All I know is that the mess in my pants, smelled pretty bad.

As to flying into PHL, that's sort of my bread and butter with a huge hub for our partner airline there. Flying over the Delaware River isn't what's tough. The airplane doesn't know it's over a river. But in airplanes like PHL where there's a ton of traffic traffic tends to be spaced very closely together making it a bit more stressful for everyone.

ahh, good to know. thanks! I always just assumed there was some wacky pressure changes and winds coming across the river.

[busdriver1959]

Thanks for giving some insight on this... I had no idea. I think it was probably a gust of wind. we werent following anything, as we were literally, 3 or 4 seconds from touch down. All I know is that the mess in my pants, smelled pretty bad.



ahh, good to know. thanks! I always just assumed there was some wacky pressure changes and winds coming across the river.

Being 3 or 4 seconds from touchdown increases the likelihood that it was wake turbulence. The vortices come off the wing and sink until they hit the ground. They also move off to the side unless there is a light crosswind. Then, the upwind vortex is held right on the runway. We know you were close to the ground, we can only guess about the crosswind. I'm betting that a miniature, powerful, sideways tornado was probably just spinning there, waiting for you to mess up your pants.

[MarkC]

I'm going to do close to 100k miles this year :( mostly in 737/757 ships. The new first class cabins on SAS's 330/340 are very nice if you get the chance. Prefer 777 but the 330/340 are pleasant aircraft. Window seats in row 1 of the 747 are fun. The curve on the nose is such that you can see straight out. More or less.

Most fun flying was in an Ercoupe, seconded by a buddies Mooney M20, and thirded by a SF Bay tour in another buddies 182T. There is a glider club nearby and I'd like to try that out.

[rwsaunders]

Another baby flying in the seat next to you distraction tool...do a crossword puzzle from the airline mag. Look at 38 down of the puzzle from today's Sea-Pdx flight on Horizon. How fitting.

[Mabouya]

You would think that 69 down would have been "Elba" but that's too short. Must be "exile."

[rwsaunders]

An hour NW of ORD this morning on the red eye from SEA. It looked like we were flying into a volcano and it was pretty cool as the pilots navigated the slot.

[SteveP]

digging this one back out.

anyone see the plane that got caught in the hailstorm somewhere up there?
must have been a terrifying flight for sure.
picture showed the cockpit window totally cracked to the point where the pilots could not see out of it and had to do an instrument landing..
and the nose cone of the plane was completely caved in from the storm.

talk about scared shitless
these planes can take a lot for sure.

pilot question.
why didn't this plane avoid this storm?
im asking not to assign fault but just to understand

[EricKeller]

they obviously misjudged the severity of that particular cell, or its position. I blame the weatherman, they always take the fall anyway (I knew a weatherman in the Air Force that was particularly bitter about an incident where they blamed one of his guys for a botched landing)

[edoz]

Between my time in the military and growing up with an uncle who flew old crop dusters and shit that if I have a seat belt and cabin pressure, I'm good. A nice lady who brings me a Coke is a bonus.