Llewellyn Bikes

[Dazza]

I can't add anymore to the adulations than to agree whole heartedly to all of them. Everytime I have spoken to or had email contact with Dazza he has been the most helpful and most generous with his advice and the time taken. I really appreciate his practical and common sense approach to his work. Makes for high quality work.

Dazza, now that you have lugs, drop outs and some braze on components in your line up and I know you have a fork crown on the way, do you have any ambition or notion to have your own spec tubing? Do the tubes that are on offer from the manufacturers cover all the frame scenarios that will be encountered? Do you see a need for using XCr, 953, etc. with the frames that you make?

Thanks mate.

Regards tubing, most of the bases are covered.
but there is a few new particular tubes I am getting Columbus to make and or remake. 35mm DT and some older seat stays I like.

Dario Pegoretti and I got Columbus onto making a XCr tubes set for XL sizes and lugs. I got some sample sets and made a frame I took to NAHBS.
This project has been slow, supply of the stainless material for Columbus to draw the tubes from is the problem
but I am told it is about to happen
Columbus is also going to have OS tubes in XCr material. This will sate the stainless fetish some punters have :-)
XCr is a good material to work with.
Stainless is not better, unless you live on a yacht, it is just interesting.
The bulk of my frames are made with Columbus tubes, a few True Temper tubes such as the 35mm .7.4.7 and their 28.6 steerer are the only odd ones.

My two fork crowns are at least two years away. I have got to let the dust settle on the recent projects and get bored again so as to sit and learn forms and surfaces in 3D CAD that are needed for these crowns!

[Dazza]

i, also, really like and appreciate the experience that you bring to this group dazza.
your frames are exceptional.
keep them coming.

Thanks Steve

I have that Cinelli poster of ya bro framed above my stairway

[Dazza]

Hey Dazza, This year at NAHBS you came over to the Shamrock Cycle's booth where I was helping Tim by talking about the bike he had built for me. Being completely new to this whole “Hand Built” bike thing I think we talked for maybe five minutes about my bike, which used your slant six lugs, but I had no clue who you were. After you had walked off Tim told me who you were and I felt like a complete tw@t. Thanks for being kind enough to listen to my dribble about your lugs and being such a good sport......PS, I love the lugs and have come to admire your work. Thanks -Andy

Don't feel bad, I do that all the time
and even this morning I got into trouble ;-)

Slant 6 was the old name, that was in a previous life, now they are called XL Compact only because I have not got any thing better to call them yet.
Any ideas?

[Dazza]

Dazza,

THANKS, Thanks for your work on the lugs. I like the sloping lugset quite a bit for smaller bikes to keep the appearence in a pleasant proportion and the intergrated seatpost binder I much prefer to the other style. You've also always been helpful to the newer guys without being condescending or sounding bitter.

Now for the question. What % of your frame sales stay in your country and what % goes elsewhere? Can you give us a sneak peak or hint about the coming fork crown?

Thanks Jonathan.
I can get get dark and angry, it passes quickly when I remember all the times I was an idiot, fool and or lacked empathy!
1/3 of my income is now from international sales. Over half of the international income is from the sale of my castings. Lug sales increased dramatically when some changes were changed to my distribution net work ;-)
I cannot make frames fast enough, but I can pack more parcels and have Ginger take them to the PO :-)
The fork crown I am pondering on will look a bit like the LC32 (pic below) , but 6-8 mm wider, longer tube sockets and have no hole underneath, but fully open to the steerer, so there is not need to drill vents in the blades, washing flux out will be so easy, spraying goo inside dead easy.
Straight blade (there are lots of nice curved blade crowns and no need to make more) brake axle 90* to the steerer axis!
25.4 and 28.6 steerer versions.

[Dazza]

Dazza: you are, in Four Corners parley "the whole enchilada" PS - the limpets are sweet - Garro.

Cheers mate

I am happy you like the Limpets
Gromit likes em as well

[72gmc]

Dazza, one of the best employers I ever worked for gave me words I still use: "Promotion is not an attendance prize." I like that it's not just about time spent on the job, but time well spent. From what I've read in your posts I think you might agree.

Is there one thing you can identify that is, in terms of your framebuilding, time particularly well spent? From my perspective I wonder if it isn't the time you spend away from the bench, wrenching for racers.

Thank you for your posts and your bicycles. I hope to see one in person someday.

[Flux]

Dazza,

How many of your complete machines go out the door with wheels built by you?

PS: can you build for me, that works in conjunction with my Llewellyn Work Stand, a BB holder that fits PF30 shells and bring it to NAHBS?

Best,
Justin

[progetto]

Dazza,
How many full time builders left in Australia do you think are making an income solely from frames coming out of thier workshops? Do you sell many complete bikes and if so do you get components through the usual local suppliers or elsewhere? My first real frameset was a used Hoffy bought local (1979), most of the guy's in our club raced on them and also" Farliegh" framesets, do you know where they were made. Had three older guys in my shop yesterday with thier Hoffy cycling jersey's on, all from Sandgate area and obviosly still shop there, they were in town for a few days riding in the country.
Bill

[conorb]

Dazza,

Let me just start out by echoing most of the sentiments already expressed here. The framebuilding community would certainly have a large gap if you hung up the torch or never decided to enter the fray and for that I can only say "Thank You."

Your work has definitely been a point of inspiration for me and I feel a certain kinship with you in terms of lugs, stainless bits, stem kits and the like. I'm not trying to say that what I do is what you do, but rather I feel your pain and I know of the toil of which you speak.

Like they say in Heartbreak Ridge; "we've chewed some of the same dirt. Sir." And yes, you are Sir in my book.

Sloping top tube lugged bikes. Check.
Modern capabilities and solid engineering. Check
Different tubes for different riders. Check.
Functional beauty and solid design. Check
Work and toil. Check

The range of work that you present as your normal/standard capabilities is vast and something that most of us can only aspire.

You've got it all mate and I appreciate what you do and what you stand for.

So that's it. I'm not really sure if I have a question.

Conor

[DCT]

dazza,

whats the price for one of your frameset

f/fork/stem

also

f/fork

usd

[Dazza]

Dazza, one of the best employers I ever worked for gave me words I still use: "Promotion is not an attendance prize." I like that it's not just about time spent on the job, but time well spent. From what I've read in your posts I think you might agree.

Is there one thing you can identify that is, in terms of your framebuilding, time particularly well spent? From my perspective I wonder if it isn't the time you spend away from the bench, wrenching for racers.

Thank you for your posts and your bicycles. I hope to see one in person someday.

Is there one thing you can identify that is, in terms of your framebuilding, time particularly well spent? From my perspective I wonder if it isn't the time you spend away from the bench, wrenching for racers.

I would say every minute of being away from the bench is learning, or attempting to learn some thing.
be it wrenching, riding, listening, reading books, listening to Australia's Radio National, reading posts and stuff from other builders makes me think of where and what I am going.
Working at the bench is one's chance to put into practice what one has learnt
and I have no way done it right, or have got it right
I just keep on trying to get it right

I will quote some thing Richie wrote a while back which I have on the workshop wall (he writes some good stuff)
– frame builders build frames to build frames.
If they finally perfect the gig, there'd be no effin reason in the
world to come in and continue. To a man, the primary task of all
the frame builders I know is to improve, and not to remain the status
quo yo.

[Dazza]

Dazza,

How many of your complete machines go out the door with wheels built by you?

PS: can you build for me, that works in conjunction with my Llewellyn Work Stand, a BB holder that fits PF30 shells and bring it to NAHBS?

Best,
Justin

Of complete bikes shipped, I would say 75% leave with hand built wheels. They might have some fancy trick wheels as well, the smart ones know that the default day in and day out training wheels are best $ value if they are 32 -36 hole standard wheels. You don't get fitter, stronger or faster because you rode 20 spoked wheels .......................

Sigh! Life is more complicated than circa 1985 eh!
BB support for PF-30 shells, you are the first to ask, maybe some thing we look into
oh and I will not be at NAHBS next year
I love the show, but it is a strain to do it every year from here. Maybe 2012.

[Dazza]

Dazza,
How many full time builders left in Australia do you think are making an income solely from frames coming out of thier workshops? Do you sell many complete bikes and if so do you get components through the usual local suppliers or elsewhere? My first real frameset was a used Hoffy bought local (1979), most of the guy's in our club raced on them and also" Farliegh" framesets, do you know where they were made. Had three older guys in my shop yesterday with thier Hoffy cycling jersey's on, all from Sandgate area and obviosly still shop there, they were in town for a few days riding in the country.
Bill

My quick list of full time in house OZ builders

Baum
Paconi
Gellie
Hillbrick but he has his wholesale effort as well
??? who have I forgotton???
I do not Know If Peter Teschner is still doing alloy frames, but he did not make them in house.
There are others such as your self but they are not full time tragics
Not a big list, which is bit sad and dismal eh!

Eric Hendren is 82 and in fine health
Gavin Bannerman from the Qld state library and I are going to interview him soon. His history of Bill Hoffman and the Hoffy shop (est 1928) and Sandgate needs to be recorded and it shall be done.
The shop is a different animal now compared to what I knew in 1979

[Dazza]

Dazza,

Let me just start out by echoing most of the sentiments already expressed here. The framebuilding community would certainly have a large gap if you hung up the torch or never decided to enter the fray and for that I can only say "Thank You."

Your work has definitely been a point of inspiration for me and I feel a certain kinship with you in terms of lugs, stainless bits, stem kits and the like. I'm not trying to say that what I do is what you do, but rather I feel your pain and I know of the toil of which you speak.

Like they say in Heartbreak Ridge; "we've chewed some of the same dirt. Sir." And yes, you are Sir in my book.

Sloping top tube lugged bikes. Check.
Modern capabilities and solid engineering. Check
Different tubes for different riders. Check.
Functional beauty and solid design. Check
Work and toil. Check

The range of work that you present as your normal/standard capabilities is vast and something that most of us can only aspire.

You've got it all mate and I appreciate what you do and what you stand for.

So that's it. I'm not really sure if I have a question.

Conor

That's very nice of you Conor
Thank you.

The world of bespoke frame building would still steam ahead no matter what or where I am, or did.
to borrow from Nick Cave's
You're one microscopic cog
in his catastrophic plan
That is me, just a little tiny part of it all

Oh and I am a Nick Cave fan.
That might scare some people!

[Dazza]

dazza,

whats the price for one of your frameset

f/fork/stem

also

f/fork

usd

The Collection are all $3,618.00 aud
Today's exchange is .98 us = 1.00 aud
so about $3, 545.64 usd
Stem is an extra $450 aud painted with the frame. (19 of 20 frames go out the door with stem)

The Lucentezza models (lots of shiny stainless and frilly lugs) are $8,590.00aud includes stem and spacer.
It's the polishing time for these and lug and dropout cutting. 200 to 230 hours.

[Wisey]

This post is not so much directed to Dazza, but is rather, about him. It is really interesting to read all the comments that each of you have made and realise how Dazza has influenced or impressed you in some fashion. I thought I would add my own two cents worth as I am privileged to have a perspective that goes a little beyond the world of frame building. That is not to take anything away from anyone else here, as I too am a steel frame lover and a part time hack who hasn’t progressed any further than a few repairs thus far. So, what about Dazza?

Having crossed paths a few times many years back when we were both racing, I knew who Dazza was and that he built frames, but I was too busy racing on my new fangled carbon Trek to be overly concerned with his ‘old fashioned’ frames. We crossed paths again in 2006 when I decided that I wanted to get myself a good lugged steel frame, just for the sheer pleasure of riding one. That led to the building of a friendship with one of the most honest, unassuming, down to earth, hard working and humble people I have ever met, Darrell Lewellyn McCulloch. While he appears here as the celebrity frame building media tart that you’re all so familiar with, there is a whole other Dazza that you folk don’t get to see much of. He calls himself a bike tragic, but this is not really the case. Tragics are usually experts in their field, but tend to know very little about anything else. Dazza however, has a keen interest in anything and everything else. I think, a part of what drives his constant improvement in his work is his natural curiosity and sense of discovery. Whether it’s organic gardening, CAD programs, politics, aircraft (particulary WW2 fighters) or economics, Dazza is always keen to learn, to understand, and if possible to dabble. Dazza talks often of toil. Nobody can dispute that the amount of toil that he puts into his frames makes the difference between a good frame and a great frame. There is however, more to it than that. Dazza pours his heart and soul into every frame that he builds. That is why he adds steps to the build process rather than finding as many ways as possible to streamline production. I once asked him what he would build if he built his own dream bike. He sort of looked at me quizzically and replied, “they’re all my bikes”.

The Dazza I know is a guy who can make you laugh so much on a training ride that you can’t breath. Who is always interested in what is happening in your life. Who is always encouraging and patient. He is the life of the party at any gathering. He sees right through the BS that surrounds us in daily life. When I complain about the crowds at the shopping centre at Christmas, he just says “ignore it, it goes away every year”. Having worked on and of in the bike game for a lot of years, I can say that they greatest compliment I have ever received was when Dazza – inspecting a set of wheels that I built for myself – simply said, “you’ve done a really good job on these”. We still disagree on a few things like the best shaped brake levers, and the best wine from d’Arenberg (Sticks & Stones, The Coppermine Road, and The Dead Arm really are so much better that that wishy washy Grenache plonk that happens to share its name with Dazza’s Custodian marquee) He’s a good mate, and while I love my Llewellyn #332 to death, I would be happy just to go for a ride with the bloke on any bike on any day. A good Sunday is a ride with Dazza. A great Sunday is a ride with Dazza in the morning, then fish and chips at Doug’s on the bay in the cool evening with Dazza, Ginger and whoever else shows up. If you get the opportunity to sit down and have a chin way over a Spitfire Ale, ask him to tell the story about Brosso, Ekimov, and the crashed team car. It’s a cracker.

The simple things in life count the most, and Dazza has perfected that art of living simply.

[M_A_Martin]

Dario is clever man when it comes to bikes
but he can lead you into trouble
all before 10.30am hic, burp

I love that memory.

[SteveP]

nice piece wisey.
he looks like the guy with the bowie knife in the movie...
that i forget the name of.

[e-RICHIE]

nice piece wisey.
he looks like the guy with the bowie knife in the movie...
that i forget the name of.

crocodile dazdee atmo.

[Too Tall]

I'll just say it. My favorite bikes you make are simple race bikes and the more elaborate ones that consume your waking hrs. and burn your knuckles I love for the skill, dedication and preservation of what is a rare art in the world of bicycles.

Brother it is a days work to bust your ba!!s becuase you are humble and competent. NONE THE LESS I'm looking for to that day to come (wink wink).

When I look at your body of work and hear the man's words what rises to the top are your burning passion to properly fit riders onto your bikes, give them builds that will likely last longer than they care to own them. Good stuff.

I'm a little disturbed you've only created bicycles that accomodate riders up to 6'3". You may be the Babe Ruth framebuilder of OZ but sir....you are a heightest ;)

Peace, Josh