44 Bikes

[dogrange]

That's my bike! The fact that you guys like it made my morning.

I'm picking it up tonight. I can't wait! :)

Ride report, ASAP, please!

[cp43]

Ride report, ASAP, please!

I've got a ride planned for Sunday, unfortunately I won't be able to get out for much of a ride before that. I'll put together a report after that.

Chris

[Todd Mosley]

It's a subtle nuance of word smithing and definition when I speak of "Shredding" (and to understand that you need to understand my mindset as it comes from the influence of what defines a "pro" in the bmx scene during the 90's.)

Fill me in - what defined a pro bmx'er in the 90's?

[fortyfour]

Full write up on all the details that went into this Huntsman build found here on the 44HQ Blog.

[Chad]

Dude, out of the park, again.

[fortyfour]

Fill me in - what defined a pro bmx'er in the 90's?

So if memory serves me correctly, the abridged version is that you had competition ramp riders and then this whole thing called "BMX Street". You'd have guys who primarily rode street enter ramp comps or comps that had pre-format style courses if you will with halfpipes, tables, etc. and choke. But then you'd take a traditional ramp rider and put them out on the street and they'd flounder. So much of BMX is using the environment around you and adapting to the terrain to link tricks or even invent new ones. So the question started floating around in mags and talk in general about what defined a "Pro" in the bmx world when you had these two forms converging and distinct styles/mindsets emerging. The bigger question was did you have to enter a comp and compete in a series of events to maintain sponsorship and be labeled a "Pro"? Clearly there was a segment of riders who are pushing limits well past anything you'd see at a comp as they were not tied to a specific format of ramps or obstacles. And in many ways at times doing some seriously dangerous tricks and linking combinations that were INSANE. And some even were so crazy failure was all but certain but they still went for it. (One that comes to mind is Robbie Morales infamous gap attempt.)

The bigger point being that these guys were going for it and pushing limits with no need for any competition to tell them to go for it. They were doing it for themselves and pushing the limits of the sport on their own terms. I know this is a big part of why the BMX industry bifurcated off in the 90's and a lot of riders formed businesses/brands around this mentality and need to create something all their own and not tied to any industry. The industry they knew was their own among friends and none of the big players were making what they actually needed. I know something that I carry with me along these lines is this statement that i want to say was being emphasized in a lot of formats: "Full Commitment". That means, to me, to go for it. Serious focus. And all of that is not dictated by any parameters imposed by some governing body telling you where to ride, what to ride and how to ride. So yeah, that's where I come from or at least my brain is hard wired that way because of the influence of the BMX world at that time.

Hope that helps to expand on that topic? Hence: Shred More. Race Less.

[fortyfour]

This past summer I sent a Marauder complete to John Watson of the Radavist for review. He's had it for an extended period of time and just posted up his thoughts on the build...

Read the full review and view the photo essay at The Radavist.



Photo Courtesy of John Watson of the Radavist.

[fortyfour]

Dovetailing with the above review, I took some time to outline the process and all the thought that went into John's review build...

Read up on what makes this bike tick here via the 44HQ Blog.



The bike before it was sent out and done got dirty...

[funcrusher]

any reason you didnt use the covert? would make a clean build even cleaner!

[fortyfour]

any reason you didnt use the covert? would make a clean build even cleaner!

First: I did not want to put any additional holes in the frame than necessary.

Second: The post was technically my own which after the review was over I was going to put it on my own Marauder which has all external cable routing to try a dropper out and form an opinion. (It appears John will be keeping the frame and dropper however, so I have to order another now...)

[nahtnoj]

So a Super Huntsman - with a 2x drivetrain, that would be simpler, yes? Shimano I'm talking here.

[fortyfour]

So a Super Huntsman - with a 2x drivetrain, that would be simpler, yes? Shimano I'm talking here.

The client's request was specifically for a Triple and the ability to run a wide range cassette that had either a 34t or 36t cog. I originally suggested we look into a 2x11 setup or a 1x11 where we play with the chainring tooth count but the triple was a "must have" set up. That created some compatibility issues but I think we found some good solutions to make everything play nicely.

Where you run into problems is that none of the mtn or road 11spd mechanical stuff is compatible (Shimano). For the most part, none of the mountain and road 10 spd stuff is compatible either BUT, and there is a but, you can possibly use a mountain crank and a mountain cassette with road derailleurs. But it depends on the tooth count of that largest cog. The amount of cable that mtn. and road shifters pull are totally different with the introduction of mountains "dyna-sis" stuff. So there's that to solve too. But, I was able to solve it with a suggestion of the Jtek Shiftmate and the right mix of components.

Make sense? Ideally I would have preferred a 2x setup or a 1x setup for this rig but the client is stoked and that's all that matters!

[CXinNH]

Where you run into problems is that none of the mtn or road 11spd mechanical stuff is compatible (Shimano). For the most part, none of the mountain and road 10 spd stuff is compatible either BUT, and there is a but, you can possibly use a mountain crank and a mountain cassette with road derailleurs.

For 10 speed SRAM mtn and road is compatible - correct? At least my sram shifters are happy with a clutch x0 derailleur and any cassette I use.
Has that gone away for SRAM 11sp?
I know it never worked great for Shimano.

[nahtnoj]

Make sense?

To a guy who has paid basically zero attention to MTB drivetrains since about 2004, no!

But, this is moot with Di2, right? You just use a mid-range 6870 RD and its all good up to a 34 cassette or so?

[fortyfour]

For 10 speed SRAM mtn and road is compatible - correct? At least my sram shifters are happy with a clutch x0 derailleur and any cassette I use.
Has that gone away for SRAM 11sp?
I know it never worked great for Shimano.

Correct, all Sram 10spd road and mountain, according to Sram.. are compatible. All Sram 11 speed road and mountain are apparently NOT compatible.

[fortyfour]

To a guy who has paid basically zero attention to MTB drivetrains since about 2004, no!

But, this is moot with Di2, right? You just use a mid-range 6870 RD and its all good up to a 34 cassette or so?

What you need to know is this: When Shimano introduced "Dyna-sis" shifting in their mountain bike shifters/derailleurs, they changed how much cable is pulled per click. So road and mountain Shimano are no longer compatible. 10 speed or 11 speed. None of it is compatible. You need to stay within the groups and allocated speeds. The only caveat is that you can possibly run a 10 speed mountain cassette with a 10 speed road group. But the caveat to that is that it depends on what the low end of the cassette is. A long cage Ultegra rear derailleur does not work with a 36t cassette FYI. The rear derailleur pulleys slam into the last cog and no amount of b-tension will get it out of the way. Shimano does not make a 34t cassette either (or at least not that I saw via my OE account). Their cassettes go up to 32t in road, then 36t in 10spd mountain and 40 or 42t in 11 speed mountain. This is why I had to use mixed components and deploy that Jtek Shiftmate.

Shimano Di2 is a different story so long as you keep road front &rear derailleurs or mountain front & rear derailleurs - the shifters don't care. You can't mix and match that stuff though from what I understand: So you'd have to have a pair of road hooded shifters with a set of XTR front and rear derailleurs.

[mmoore]

Correct, all Sram 10spd road and mountain, according to Sram.. are compatible. All Sram 11 speed road and mountain are apparently NOT compatible.

does SRAM even make a triple? making it irrelevant for this bike...

[fortyfour]

does SRAM even make a triple? making it irrelevant for this bike...

I know as per their listings on their website they have a a triple in their X5, X7 and X9 10spd (44-33-22t). But another request by the client was Shimano. I only mention Sram as I suspected the conversation would generate questions about who's 10 or 11 speed stuff is compatible.

[mmoore]

I know as per their listings on their website they have a a triple in their X5, X7 and X9 10spd (44-33-22t). But another request by the client was Shimano. I only mention Sram as I suspected the conversation would generate questions about who's 10 or 11 speed stuff is compatible.

yeah, they don't have triple road levers to facilitate the FD? anyways, sweet ride, neat choice in components. I bet its awesome.

[cp43]

Ride report, ASAP, please!

Ride report, short version. It's a great bike!

I've done three rides since picking it up. First was maybe a mile, around my neighborhood Friday night. This was mainly to test out the light (eDelux 2) It's a great light. Very wide light pattern, and a very long throw.

Second ride was Saturday, ~7 miles, a quick ride to make sure everything was bolted on tight for a longer ride on Sunday. It was pretty casual and slow, but I did find that the bike is very stable riding no-hands. Something that my previous dirt road bike isn't great at.

Yesterday was the first real ride, ~50 road miles, with some friends. (https://www.strava.com/activities/446041803) It was almost all on pavement, with two brewery stops. The biggest surprise was how good the Huntsman is as a fast road bike. With the 52mm tires, I was expecting to have to really work to keep up with everyone on road bikes. The rolling resistance on the WTB Nanos on the road wasn't bad at all. It is also more responsive to power input that I was expecting. Not quite super stiff road bike responsive, but much better than I was expecting, and far better than my previous gravel bike. It didn't feel heavy on the (minimal) climbs either. I usually feel like I need to shift way down (the reason for the triple) and spin up pretty much everything. Yesterday I felt great punching up the short hills. I didn't think about the handling at all during the ride, which must mean that it's just right. It wasn't an exciting route in terms of corners, so I didn't get a chance to really push things, but so far, so good.

I was also expecting to be under geared, with a 42x11 biggest combo. This didn't end up being a problem, but I'm still thinking that I might change out the chainrings for something bigger when the current ones wear out. Currently there 42/32/24, I'll likely try 46/34/22 when the time comes. Front shifting was great, quick shifts, no dropped chain. It took me a while to get used to the shifter, but by halfway through, everything was good. The rear shifting isn't quite dialed yet. I need to take a close look at the shiftmate and make sure it's just right. When I picked up the bike, Kris mentioned that it was very sensitive to cable stretch, so it should just be a matter of getting the tension just right.

I decided to try out some different bars and saddle from my usual with this build. Bars are ENVE compacts. At first I was wanting a little more reach to them, but they grew on me, and turned out to be very comfortable. The saddle is a Selle Italia Flite, it's very firm, but pretty comfortable. I think I need to adjust the angle a hair, and all will be well there.

Mostly, I'm struck by how well it did as a road bike. Tomorrow I'm going to get in some dirt road riding, I'm expecting to have a lot of fun!

Chris