Espresso machines

[Ras72]

This whole thread seems like a huge rationalization when all you are really craving is some caffeine. I know, you can all quit tomorrow if you wanted to. ...
But you don't want to . . .

It's all in what you want out of life... I want good caffeine. And no, I couldn't quit drinking caffeine if I wanted to.

[Eric Estlund]

Cool- thanks, Nick. I'll have to keep that on my mental list. We have a friend who is a hobby roaster who might be going full time; feeding the machine good/ fresh beans might be easier soon.

[Kupepe]

Go for a Gaggia Baby. Excellent Steam Pressure, Inox parts where it matters, great quality and never fails. Super First time Espresso machine ... great VFM

[aaronv]

as for the box wine nespresso analogy, nice try but no, not the same. you see buying wine is easy(appreciating it is subjective though). to make the preferred shot takes more effort than you probably know based on your comment. if you think you do then i'll assume your taste in coffee are less than you give yourself credit for. but the reality is, i think the "perfect" shot is more about the pursuit. you don't enjoy the coffee like you would a nice susumaniello salento. rather you get off on the pursuit that shot.

ymmv

If you are solely a boxed wine drinker, you've committed to restricting your choices to a few dozen options. It's similar with the pod system. If you want to explore different roasts and varietals then pods aren't going to cut it. It's being able to try out a range of coffees in espresso form that having your own equipment allows. I'm sure there are folks that are pursuing the best crema as a source of personal fulfillment, to master a skill. But I think there is far too much mystique built up around the process. It takes a little practice to get a good results, but its certainly within the realm of someone with modest equipment and the ability to pay attention.

[Brandon White]

I get why people are trying to make the Box wine = Nespresso analogy, but it doesn't work. I'm with Nick on this.

Corking a bottle is just as easy as opening a wine box. Nespresso is easy. Setting up a manual machine with an external PID, modded screen, pressure gauge, aftermarket insulator, a quality grinder (more than a nespresso machine) seems like a pain in the ass. Getting good beans is easy really. It's all the extra stuff. Now if the nespresso crew wanted to drop another $500 - $1000, they could get an automatic saeco or jura and probably be more content with flavor and coffee choices, but it's really all about bang for the buck, convenience, and settling on what your taste buds will accept, right?

[Matthew Strongin]

If you want to explore different roasts and varietals then pods aren't going to cut it.

Nespresso offers like 15 different options with a regular and steady stream of limited editions. I'm certain that my palete can't distinguish beyond the subtleties in a range with that many options. Their latest special offering is a Cuban coffee, something I have experience with. Is it as good as the local coffee window? Better than some, not as good as most. But it's good enough for a super tasty kick in the ass to get my day going.

[aaronv]

Nespresso offers like 15 different options with a regular and steady stream of limited editions. I'm certain that my palete can't distinguish beyond the subtleties in a range with that many options. Their latest special offering is a Cuban coffee, something I have experience with. Is it as good as the local coffee window? Better than some, not as good as most. But it's good enough for a super tasty kick in the ass to get my day going.

You can't have honest arguments about personal taste. My point was that you can't easily try out another beans from another roaster or a gift of beans with the pod systems.

[crumpton]

Nespresso offers like 15 different options with a regular and steady stream of limited editions. I'm certain that my palete can't distinguish beyond the subtleties in a range with that many options. Their latest special offering is a Cuban coffee, something I have experience with. Is it as good as the local coffee window? Better than some, not as good as most. But it's good enough for a super tasty kick in the ass to get my day going.

actually 22 plus specials.

[crumpton]

You can't have honest arguments about personal taste. My point was that you can't easily try out another beans from another roaster or a gift of beans with the pod systems.

good. like bibs and shoes, i dont want other people buying them for me because they liked it. of course i'm just having fun here.

[aaronv]

Setting up a manual machine with an external PID, modded screen, pressure gauge, aftermarket insulator, a quality grinder (more than a nespresso machine) seems like a pain in the ass.

It does sound like a pain in the ass. I'm making the argument that you don't need all that high-end equipment to have a decent home espresso setup. A pump driven semi-automatic machine from a reputable maker should just work. You can find a hand burr grinder for about $40, but yeah it's not "professional grade". Bang for the buck, those pods are very expensive. Definitely the pods win the convenience argument.

[Matthew Strongin]

You can't have honest arguments about personal taste. My point was that you can't easily try out another beans from another roaster or a gift of beans with the pod systems.

What about personal preference, such as the desire to try a large variety of beans or the pursuit of the perfect crema. This is a discussion about coffee makers. Nothing is gospel. But if you like variety and convenience, maybe one of these will work: http://www.amazon.com/Refillable-Cap.../dp/B007SJEGVK

Let's all keep in mind that it is possible to own and use more than one type of coffee production method and to recognize that they can all serve their intended purpose. For example, I love my Nespresso for the convenience. I also have a pile of French Presses for some really nice Farmer Friendly beans i score from time to time, a Moka pot for my own weak attempt at cuban coffee, and a *gasp* drip coffee pot for those brunch parties when I'm not about to taint my french press with Folgers. My favorite means of producing an espresso is stopping mid-ride with a buddy at Panther Coffee so I can tack on an empanada or ham croissant and pretend it won't make me fat because I'm on a bike ride. But it's hard to do that every morning and still keep my job.

[lukasz]

Box wine and pod coffee? Come ooooon. One is more efficient to transport, probably better than the traditional method for the product, but not as pleasing to consume. The other is Nespresso.

[dashDustin]

serious question...

is there much difference between the Verismo from Starbucks and Nespresso?

[Matthew J]

serious question...

is there much difference between the Verismo from Starbucks and Nespresso?

Ubiquity /=/ quality, so I would say likely no.

[Philster]

What about personal preference, such as the desire to try a large variety of beans or the pursuit of the perfect crema. This is a discussion about coffee makers. Nothing is gospel. But if you like variety and convenience, maybe one of these will work: http://www.amazon.com/Refillable-Cap.../dp/B007SJEGVK

Let's all keep in mind that it is possible to own and use more than one type of coffee production method and to recognize that they can all serve their intended purpose. For example, I love my Nespresso for the convenience. I also have a pile of French Presses for some really nice Farmer Friendly beans i score from time to time, a Moka pot for my own weak attempt at cuban coffee, and a *gasp* drip coffee pot for those brunch parties when I'm not about to taint my french press with Folgers. My favorite means of producing an espresso is stopping mid-ride with a buddy at Panther Coffee so I can tack on an empanada or ham croissant and pretend it won't make me fat because I'm on a bike ride. But it's hard to do that every morning and still keep my job.

None of those refillables get more than 3 stars, so I'm guessing they don't work great. I see further down the page that there are off-label nespresso cups. Has anybody tried some of those?

[boxerboxer]

The thing that kills the pod products for me, whether they be high pressure or low pressure brewing, is freshness of the coffee. I buy beans in half pounds at a time because anything much over a week gets stale and tastes significantly worse to me. I definitely get the convenience factor, but the minute or two of actual hands-on to get good coffee is worth it to me.

[aaronv]

None of those refillables get more than 3 stars, so I'm guessing they don't work great. I see further down the page that there are off-label nespresso cups. Has anybody tried some of those?

It would seem that filling your own capsules would negate much of the convenience. Keurig, the capsule coffee people, clamped down on third-party brands. The new machines have DRM to restrict use to only Keurig branded coffee, much like the printer manufacturers did with refillable cartridges.



Inside Keurig's plan to stop you from buying knockoff K-Cups | The Verge

[boxerboxer]

Agreed on the lowered convenience. I think the refillable capsules also make the processes less repeatable in that I think it would be a challenge to fill the things the same way twice without using a scale and some sort of tamping tool. I'm sure the machine is more or less dialed in for the disposable capsules.

[Octave]

For those with an inclination towards environmental-friendliness, those pods are amongst the worst convenience choices you can make with regards to cost (to the environment and your pocket) vs convenience (I mean really, is a making coffee that difficult?

An accessible report on the matter.

With that out of the way, I'll re-endorse the notion that your grinder is equally, if not more important than your actual espresso machine. I've had a pretty high quality espresso machine for quite some time, but only in the past year have I upgraded to a proper grinder (previously had a burr, but of dubious quality..). A world of difference.

[lukasz]

And as far as grinders go, with some ebay hunting you can easily score a commercial level Mazzer (also rebranded as Rio and Astoria) at very reasonable prices. No plastic BS and very simple. Will last a lifetime.