Aussie road safety

[Cosmic Cycle]

https://escapecollective.com/things-...tralian-roads/

https://www.theage.com.au/national/v...19-p5edje.html

[j44ke]

I assume you live in Australia. What part and what’s been your experience? I think the increase in bad driving during the covid era was a common in experience in Europe and the US. Even while driving I’ve seen bat-shit crazy behavior that exceeds previous standards for bat-shit craziness. I was adding political and economic animus into the covid-era stew of reasons to explain the uptick in offensive driving.

[BBB]

In Australia, or at least where I live, there are two issues (imo). The first is impatience. Whether this is a post-Covid thing, or simply a reflection of population growth and hence pressure on the roads, is hard to say. The second is the prevalence of large 4wd utes and SUVs. The two issues came together the other day when I drive my son to the station to catch the train to school. Two cyclists were out for a ride. The interaction is two lanes, but very quickly narrows to one. A couple of people got through and I was driving behind the cyclists. I waited until it was safe to pass and eventually passed. The delay I caused in considering other people's safety obviously irritated two drivers as a large grey 4wd ute flew past me, cut in front of me and went through a red light and then passed a truck (and there's a short distance between traffic lights and a round about - the ute driver needed a ticket). As I pulled up a SUV pulled to a sudden halt next to me. Male driver. Window slightly down and smoking. The cyclists catch up and when the light goes green they tale off and end up in front of the SUV. I didn't see what happened, but there was a whole lot of yelling and from my spot in the station car park when I let my son out I could see one of the cyclists confronting the driver of the SUV from the driver's side door.

I get peak hour traffic is busy, but a little time and patience to ensure two guys riding are safe and sound should not cause angst.

[thollandpe]

II get peak hour traffic is busy, but a little time and patience to ensure two guys riding are safe and sound should not cause angst.

Impatience and entitlement symbolized by an enormous, ego-assuaging (and honestly impractical) vehicle. Similar recipe here in the US.

Study Finds 96% Of Americans Willing To Kill Anyone Who Makes Them Wait More Than 10 Seconds For Anything | The Onion

[thollandpe]

On a more serious note, I thought this piece by Jamelle Bouie summed up the situation really well. He cites data, and critiques design. As a counterpoint to the predictable responses to any article about a driver hitting (and killing) a pedestrian or cyclist, blaming irresponsible pedestrians and cyclists.

“But even if there are behavioral flaws to find as everyone moves around outdoors — drivers, cyclists and pedestrians alike — the consequences of scofflaw behavior from drivers are simply much greater, and much worse, than the consequences of scofflaw behavior from other people on the street.”

The Main Problem With Pedestrian Deaths Isn’t the Pedestrians | New York Times (unlocked gift article)

“The problem, ultimately, is about cars and trucks. And the focus, ultimately, should be on cars and trucks.”

[TonyP]

The focus should start with Drivers Ed. Here in Illinois teens need to take it to get their licenses: cover traffic flow and vehicle standing of bicycles in traffic, in detail, aimed at both drivers and cyclists. We have Traffic School as a way of skirting a ticket in lieu of a court trial, time should be spent on bicycles in traffic there also, more than just a mention. What the law is and what is expected of both bicycles and auto and trucks.

Kids are given bicycles and told to wear their helments and be careful, that's it. When they get their license that's what they're gonna know about cycling in traffic. I've seen cops on bicycle patrol riding their bikes against traffic, probably didn't even know the law and how bicycles fit in and how to enforce it.
I had a cop, who claimed to be a cyclist, tell me I had to ride in the gutter, or on the sidewalk, to not slow the traffic. I've had cars brush as they close pass, but also freak out at intersections when I've Yielded them their right of way but they froze because they didn't know what I was doing next, which points to the non-uniformity of cyclists in traffic.

All the laws in the world come to naught without education and training starting at a young age and continued through all aspects of driving and cycling in traffic, aimed at both drivers and cyclists.

There's more to driving than owning the road and more to cycling than wearing a helment and being careful. We all need to know the laws and abide by them.

[j44ke]

I doubt the anger present in most situations has its genesis in ignorance about traffic regulations.

I blame the comprehensive social psychosis created by power used persistently as a concussion grenade loaded with hammers against anyone who doesn't have it. Every day. Television, radio, Internet, marketing, politics, movies. Everything is war. Everything is last chance. Everything is in jeopardy. To fail is to lose everything near and dear. Or else.

Cars/trucks are the one place people feel anonymous but safe, protected but powerful and that allows the fuse on their psychically damaged power keg to light itself.

Locally I've seen drivers try to run high-crop and 8-tire tractors off the road because they were driving too slowly. That's not a misunderstanding of traffic regulations. That's a moment of pure insanity.

[TonyP]

I doubt the anger present in most situations has its genesis in ignorance about traffic regulations.

I blame the comprehensive social psychosis created by power used persistently as a concussion grenade loaded with hammers against anyone who doesn't have it. Every day. Television, radio, Internet, marketing, politics, movies. Everything is war. Everything is last chance. Everything is in jeopardy. To fail is to lose everything near and dear. Or else.

Cars/trucks are the one place people feel anonymous but safe, protected but powerful and that allows the fuse on their psychically damaged power keg to light itself.

Locally I've seen drivers try to run high-crop and 8-tire tractors off the road because they were driving too slowly. That's not a misunderstanding of traffic regulations. That's a moment of pure insanity.

There's no denying this. But there is also ignorance of the law, and that needs to be faced. Fixing one doesn't fix the other, but fixes need be made and every fix is a win. Stopping drunk driving doesn't stop driving while texting, but that's no reason to not acknowledge drunk driving.

[bigbill]

I doubt the anger present in most situations has its genesis in ignorance about traffic regulations.

I blame the comprehensive social psychosis created by power used persistently as a concussion grenade loaded with hammers against anyone who doesn't have it. Every day. Television, radio, Internet, marketing, politics, movies. Everything is war. Everything is last chance. Everything is in jeopardy. To fail is to lose everything near and dear. Or else.

Cars/trucks are the one place people feel anonymous but safe, protected but powerful and that allows the fuse on their psychically damaged power keg to light itself.

Locally I've seen drivers try to run high-crop and 8-tire tractors off the road because they were driving too slowly. That's not a misunderstanding of traffic regulations. That's a moment of pure insanity.

I live in a community with a HOA and a separate FB group. The comments in social media correlate with what I experience while cycling in the neighborhood. "Bicycles are toys and they belong in the park," "no man should wear lycra (spandex), women should wear lycra because (some misogynist comment)," "I can't believe they ride on the road, I'm not moving over, if I hit the cyclist, it's on them," and "they better not get in my way." The three miles to get out of my neighborhood are the worst part of my ride.

I relocated here five years ago for a job; I retired last summer, my wife is an artist and makes soap, nothing really to keep us here other than interest rates and an 80 year old FIL.

[j44ke]

There's no denying this. But there is also ignorance of the law, and that needs to be faced. Fixing one doesn't fix the other, but fixes need be made and every fix is a win. Stopping drunk driving doesn't stop driving while texting, but that's no reason to not acknowledge drunk driving.

The need for education is a given - yes - but there isn't a drunk or texter out there that doesn't know they are violating the law. My perception is that what has changed most since 2019 is an increased acceptance of expressions of self-righteous rage and indignation on an individual level and wholesale dehumanization of individuals on a societal level. Shortly, people think more of themselves and less of each other and anger is their favorite television show.

I'd be interested to hear how cycling in traffic is in Indonesia. Or China. Or Columbia. Or Argentina. Or wherever is not Europe not Australia not North America.

[TonyP]

So how do you stop feeding the anger. It's what sells, so it's sold, everywhere from TV to Politics. There is no discipline anymore, children aren't punished, criminals are released, looters are excused, there is an excuse for everything and nobody is held accountable. Things are only going to get worse.

When it's all about what sells, you don't have to buy it because people are waiting in line to. And it's sold cheap.

It starts with education and discipline and accountability, and there's little regard for any of it, more so every day.

[progetto]

most people are assholes in a vehicle, so there's that.

[BBB]

It's education for sure that will help. And better infrastructure to encourage cycling. Penalties may also need a re-work. If you are a tradie for example, and depend on driving to a job, maybe the threat of a permanent loss of licence may be enough to slow you and your 4wd ute down.

[Mark Walberg]

The need for education is a given - yes - but there isn't a drunk or texter out there that doesn't know they are violating the law........

Heather Cook for example

[sk_tle]

most people are assholes in a vehicle, so there's that.

There was a study that was basically concluding the cars shouldn't be equipped with a windshield. Being protected from the elements and lacking the wind/noise and everything makes people feel so invulnerable that nothing could restrain them, not even law or common sense.

Also driving should not be considered a right, but a privilege, that would be revoked at the lowest offense without people falsly pretending they can't live without a car. I was driving my motorbike 2 days ago in a relatively busy road, I overtook a car and my partner told me she could literally see the driver's instagram feed he was checking out while driving. These kind of attitude should mean: banned for 1 year at first offense, for life at next offense.