Outdoor/Garage WIFI Extension

[j44ke]

I am trying to extend our Internet connection from our house to our garage. The garage is a metal-sided box about 300' from the house by direct line-of-sight, and 375' using buried conduit.

I don't think I can run ethernet cable 375' from the house through conduit to the garage. I think that is too long and signal loss would be too great but correct me if I am wrong as that would be the easiest.

I've looked at outdoor point-to-point antennas, but I am unclear on the details here. We have a lot of trees around and I'm not going to chop a bunch down so I get a wide avenue of broadcast just to watch cyclocross this winter while working in the garage (my primary reason for doing this - laugh if you will.) Ubiquity and TP-Link seem to make reasonably affordable versions.

I have the Powerline adapters from our apartment in the city, and I'm going to try them but not optimistic they will get through the various apparatus between the house and the garage. Too many switches and breakers I think.

Originally I planned just to connect coaxial cable at the main junction box for the Internet and run that to the garage with its own modem and WIFI router, but the IP told me that would require a second account. Only one modem allowed per connection. Which sounds reasonably unfair.

Suggestions?

[Bob Ross]

Run fiber optic cable through your 375' conduit and put a a small SFP-enabled switch on the main house end and either an SFP-enabled WAP or another SFP-enabled switch plus a conventional WAP in the garage

...I think.

[Drew]

fiber probably the way, if you've already got conduit in the ground. I have not had opportunity to go through with this setup myself, but maybe look into:

two of these: https://www.amazon.com/Converter-SFP...dp/B0716XT1QT/

and one of these: https://www.amazon.com/Jeirdus-Outdo...07VYXPWBS?th=1

I have not researched terminating fiber ends, but that may be a requirement if you don't want to drag the terminal connectors through the conduit.

[Drew]

termination looks like a chore.

maybe do direct burial? Rent a dog fence trencher and cut your own trench, use direct burial wire, and take good notes about where you bury it...

https://www.amazon.com/RiteAV-Direct.../dp/B01J66FQKC

[Mabouya]

I've never done this before, but before I bothered to dig a nearly 400' trench to an outbuilding or try to fish something through an existing conduit, I'd try an external antenna, maybe something like this:

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00NQGVMSE...10b-wifiext-20

It looks like it has plenty of range, and the only issue will be signal loss due to trees. However, at that price ($130) it may be worth a gamble.

[sk_tle]

Another vote for fiber. But then do you really want/need to be connected to internet there and wouldn't phone tethering be enough for the handful of time you need it ?

[j44ke]

I 100% don't need this at all. But I'd enjoy having cyclocross playing in the garage while I am working in there.

I'm not afraid of the fiber option, except for the cost. Seems like it starts to add up quickly. Fiber must have been what the electrician was going to set up originally during the build, because he quoted me a price that seemed ridiculous.

I was thinking of trying these out as a sort of trial balloon. Set it up and see what it gets me.

https://www.amazon.com/TP-Link-CPE21...tronics&sr=1-3

Some of the farmers around here use long range WIFI for their weather and soil systems. Not many farms large enough for that here really, but occasionally you'll see a little white box with two antenna on a mast. And there are antennas like the ones Mabouya links on the barns or houses that aren't just leftover from the days of TV aerials. I figure those are point-to-point arrangements? A big loop around the farm.

[Bewheels]

I have several components from Ubiquity and they all work very well. Uniquity moved into the residential space from retail space and their equipment is used in stadiums as well. I am sure there is something in their line that will work for you that doesn't require more trench digging or conduit fishing.

This guy does a nice job explaining many of their products. I couldn't find it right off but he has one showing an outdoor directional set-up that he attached to a tree.

[newellbt]

NYC Mesh uses these Ubiquiti airMAX LiteBeam bridges.

[htwoopup]

I have one of these at the lake…the idea was just to get the wifi from the house to the dock so I could stream music, but I pick up my wifi from home over a good part of the lake. Basically, not only a straight shot to the dock and across the lake but in a pretty wide triangle that grows almost a half mile wide and half a mile across the water. Don’t know if it would work in your case through walls etc as I am using it just through air and a lot..a real lot…of big ole maple and birch trees. I have found the tp-link tech support/customer service incredibly good and patient with no nothing techie me so perhaps it is worth a call to ask.

https://www.tp-link.com/us/business-...ap110-outdoor/

[Peter Polack]

No; you can't run an ethernet cable 375 feet. 328 feet is the maximum.

You'll need a wireless link. I don't know how much foliage is between the house and the garage but that will affect the signal strength. You'll use directional antennas at both ends; they can be expensive. You'll need PoE injectors inside each building to power the antennas and pass the data. Then you have to run cabling from the PoE injectors to your local wifi boxes. I'm sure there are local companies that can do the work as they do this stuff on college campuses and government buildings all the time (like our company does). I'm not sure if it's cheaper than trenching fiber from the house to the garage, as well as the associated equipment.

[Doug Fattic]

My shop is about 300 feet from my house and where my framebuilding class students stay is about 500 feet. My clever nephews hooked up a wireless system that delivers decent wifi reception to both places. I have a separate router in each window facing each destination. At the shop and the other house are receiving antennas cabled to additional routers. I made sure there are no obstructions between the sending routers in my house and the receiving antennas in the other locations. The system works fine. Here is a picture of the receiving antenna and router where my students stay.
IMG_3392.jpeg

[j44ke]

No; you can't run an ethernet cable 375 feet. 328 feet is the maximum.

You'll need a wireless link. I don't know how much foliage is between the house and the garage but that will affect the signal strength. You'll use directional antennas at both ends; they can be expensive. You'll need PoE injectors inside each building to power the antennas and pass the data. Then you have to run cabling from the PoE injectors to your local wifi boxes. I'm sure there are local companies that can do the work as they do this stuff on college campuses and government buildings all the time (like our company does). I'm not sure if it's cheaper than trenching fiber from the house to the garage, as well as the associated equipment.

The TP Link stuff (and other brands) seems to come with PoE injectors standardly and our house is wired with ethernet so I can place the antenna at the highest point and keep everything inside - except for the antenna - with minimal run of cable.

My shop is about 300 feet from my house and where my framebuilding class students stay is about 500 feet. My clever nephews hooked up a wireless system that delivers decent wifi reception to both places. I have a separate router in each window facing each destination. At the shop and the other house are receiving antennas cabled to additional routers. I made sure there are no obstructions between the sending routers in my house and the receiving antennas in the other locations. The system works fine. Here is a picture of the receiving antenna and router where my students stay.
IMG_3392.jpeg

Good to see that your's is inside behind a leaded glass (I think) window! Might mean I can get a way with not having the antenna outside. Fewer holes in the house the better.

[pdxmech13]

We set up a Google Mesh unit for our property.

50x100' lot. The entire area has download and upload speed with Century Link over 200MBS.

I even get connection from our neighbors which is great. The overall cost and time was the driving factor. Set up in less than 30 minutes for 4 routers.

[gt6267a]

$80 for an over the air option seems interesting but I am curious if you'll enjoy the video performance. Regular web browsing or music won't stress the performance of a connection like video might. Even if you get a decent signal, I am wondering if it will provide a satisfying experience for streaming.

Out of curiosity, how much fishing is there with the conduit? Its new and presumably there is a string or some means of conveniently pulling wire through it. Seems like that shouldn't be a concern. Does the conduit terminate inside or outside the buildings? Especially if its inside, the optical route sounds like it would have the highest performance and reliability. $240 for a setup that should deliver satisfying video doesn't seem wild.

[j44ke]

$80 for an over the air option seems interesting but I am curious if you'll enjoy the video performance. Regular web browsing or music won't stress the performance of a connection like video might. Even if you get a decent signal, I am wondering if it will provide a satisfying experience for streaming.

Out of curiosity, how much fishing is there with the conduit? Its new and presumably there is a string or some means of conveniently pulling wire through it. Seems like that shouldn't be a concern. Does the conduit terminate inside or outside the buildings? Especially if its inside, the optical route sounds like it would have the highest performance and reliability. $240 for a setup that should deliver satisfying video doesn't seem wild.

The conduit is in two sections. From the house to the electrical & Internet service area (meter, transformer, cable terminus) and then from the service area to the garage. Straight line in each section, except to daylight at either end. Due to some challenges with the will and energy of the Spectrum installer, I fished a line from the service area to the house using a shop vac and then pulled outdoor/bury coaxial to the house with the line. I already have a pretty nice switch connected to all the ethernet outlets in the house - I did all the connecting of those - but I don't think it has any switchable outs so I'd need another switch for fiber. The conduit goes right to the back wall of the garage, but I'd have to drill a hole and mount a box etc. So not hard to do, except perhaps learning how to terminate fiber optic, unless I can get a long enough spool with ends already installed.

Using the above spool of 400' fiber optic cable as a gauge, I think costs would be in the $400-450 range with switches etc.

I'll have to think about this.

[newellbt]

can be done cheaper with a pair of gigabit ethernet media converters with gigabit multimode SFPs. Then of course the fiber.

Get a quote from a contractor for running/terminating/certifying the fiber run and byo hardware?

[Peter Polack]

I don't know how much space is in the conduit, but usually fiber comes in a corrugated plastic sheath which considerably increases the diameter.

Running an RG-6 coax from the house to the garage might be easier and its length limitations will not be exceeded. And since you'll be running it in the same conduit as AC power, any coax should be double shielded and grounded at both ends, but it will be easier to terminate than fiber. Of course, you'll use a media converter (ethernet to coax) at both ends.

[j44ke]

I don't know how much space is in the conduit, but usually fiber comes in a corrugated plastic sheath which considerably increases the diameter.

Running an RG-6 coax from the house to the garage might be easier and its length limitations will not be exceeded. And since you'll be running it in the same conduit as AC power, any coax should be double shielded and grounded at both ends, but it will be easier to terminate than fiber. Of course, you'll use a media converter (ethernet to coax) at both ends.

Ah so there's the missing piece for me - ethernet to coax media converter. The conduit is empty - was put in specifically for Internet (so I could operate my garage door from NYC - why?) so it will be just the coax in there. Everyone around here seems to use direct burial even in conduit, so I figure that's what I'll do. It is tri-shielded and I can put a grounding block in at both ends. Looks about $200 less than fiber.

Cool! Thanks for this. Lots of good info from everyone.

[Bob Ross]

Running an RG-6 coax from the house to the garage might be easier and its length limitations will not be exceeded.

...but its speed/bandwidth limitations will be exceeded, if not now then certainly within a couple of years. The only reasonably "future-proof" data cable is either fiber optic, or shielded twisted pair (e.g., CAT8 or the mythical CAT7, possibly CAT6A). And terminating bulk CAT8 makes fiber look like a Fisher-Price My First Low Voltage! toy.