Motorcycles For The Track and Circuit

[jscottyk]

As mentioned here, cranking up a discussion of track and race bikes.

Yep. Been considering everything from 390RC, to RSV4 RF, to R1, to 675R. I'm all over the place! Considering most of my time will be at COTA, the liter bikes are interesting. That said, Harris Hill, in San Marcos would be perfect on the 390RC.

COTA = LITER

R1S?

I'd say the new R6 but the price is too high and the R1 platform is just way better for a few $$ more.

Lots of good used 675 out there for great price.

There will be a new Daytona in 2019.

Or you could have your balls smashed and roasted on a baby panigale........only way I would own one would be for 30 minute track sessions and to have in the garage to look at. 959's are going cheap. Lots of 899 out there too.

Ball roasting isn't an issue since they moved the exhaust? The seat warmer exhaust on my 999 was appreciated in the shoulder seasons in Canada. And 148hp hardly makes a baby out of the 899 Panigale, more like a hell child. 1098s are cheap now, though a little light on power for the displacement by current standards, but my Ducati shop guy says they were a better built bike than the Panigale. I'm not going to miss the 10hp, but would appreciate the 25% increase in torque, and I could pay for 2 years of tires and insurance with the cost savings.

When I started to seriously considering a track bike, a starting point of a Ducati 1198SP was my first choice. After discussing things with James Compton, he suggested that unless I was a Ducatista, I might want to consider something like an R1 or RSV4 in liter bikes, or an R6 or 675R in the midweights. This bike will mainly be a tool, but I style and form are a bit important to me too. Honestly, I just don't like the shape of the R6 so it quickly feel off my list. Top consideration currently is R1, RSV4 or 675R.

[dogrange]

I wish I had more to add, but here are my impressions, all very [U]not[U] well informed as I have not been on a bike in 8 years:

1098 series: best-looking Ducati of the last decade, trellis frame can't be beat for looks

Panigale: a bit meh for looks, I'd go 1098

R1: last time I was in Boston (I think in September) someone rode one of the new ones down Newbury street as I was walking. It had a very loud aftermarket exhaust. It sounded really great.

RSV4: totally cool, looks great

[jscottyk]

I wish I had more to add, but here are my impressions, all very [U]not[U] well informed as I have not been on a bike in 8 years:

1098 series: best-looking Ducati of the last decade, trellis frame can't be beat for looks

Panigale: a bit meh for looks, I'd go 1098

R1: last time I was in Boston (I think in September) someone rode one of the new ones down Newbury street as I was walking. It had a very loud aftermarket exhaust. It sounded really great.

RSV4: totally cool, looks great

The current R1 with crank basically acts like a fast spinning v-four and sounds amazing, as does the RSV4. I like the lines of the RSV4 more, but the electronics of the R1 are reported to be pretty darn amazing.

[dgaddis]

I have nothing useful to add but to be careful and have fun. A buddy of mine has an R1 (no idea what year, probably 5yrs old now, if not older), I've watched him take it down the drag strip. He didn't launch it super hard 'cause he didn't want to land on his ass, and it still ran the 1/4mile in 10.4secs @ 140mph. Gah those things are fast!!! It was totally stock, he said more experienced drag racers could get the stock bike across the line in under 10 seconds.

Same guy also had a Suzuki SV1000, that thing was sweet, that V-twin sounded great.

[jscottyk]

I have nothing useful to add but to be careful and have fun. A buddy of mine has an R1 (no idea what year, probably 5yrs old now, if not older), I've watched him take it down the drag strip. He didn't launch it super hard 'cause he didn't want to land on his ass, and it still ran the 1/4mile in 10.4secs @ 140mph. Gah those things are fast!!! It was totally stock, he said more experienced drag racers could get the stock bike across the line in under 10 seconds.

Same guy also had a Suzuki SV1000, that thing was sweet, that V-twin sounded great.

Oh yeah, these latest liter bikes are around 200 horsepower and capable of 180+ mph on long tracks like COTA. My 2018 Triumph Street Triple RS is 765cc, no fairing, and should be able to hit about 140mph on the back straight of COTA. The most crazy thing is, screaming down that straight feels safe. The runoff is great and the brakes on these modern bikes are as amazing as the engines.

[pdxmech13]

The R1 Cross Plane is amaze balls. I wouldn't say it sounds as good as a true V-Twin but it has a distinct aura about it. Listening to Cameron Beaubier's at Laguna Seca is surreal and is just plan angry.

My coworker has a 16 and it's truly something amazing. Chassis is so dialed that such little input is really needed and the IMU is out of this world. Lots of parts available for them and obviously you get the tuning fork reliability with Rossi's blessing. Damn ugly front end though. If I were plunking down money for one as a track bike I'd get the R1S. Saves about $2k right off the top.

I don't think there is a better bike all around than the V-twin of the Aprilla. Most journo's would agree and the noise.......OMG. They were the first on many fronts including IMU tech. The only problem is the dealer network and overall reliability of spinning a motor 14K RPM all summer. The auto blipper on the 17 is pure freakin SEX!!!!!!

The new Ninja that REA is riding is pretty sweet to even though it's not even close to the same animal. Great chassis and good electronics as well.

The 959 I rode was one of the most disappointing bike riding experiences I've had in the last year. I really wanted to love it but it isn't meant for anything other than the track and at the RPM's it needs to be in it's a freaking rattle can and crotch burner. No thanks. I'll just look at them on my Instagram feed.

Rode my Speed today for about 2 hours in 37 degree weather. Damn I love 2 wheels.

[jerk]

I love my Supersport now that I've put clip-ons on it. If you don't need the horsepower, it's a blast to play with on the track. Given my abilities- it's more fun than the 200hp bikes.

[dennis]

Was stationed in Germany when I went from a 1976 BMW R100s to an R1 with the front sprocket dropped a tooth to give it more boost off the line. Guy who owned it before me would take it to the drag strip. When I test rode it he told me "Just get to third gear as carefully as possible" Something about landing on your butt if you dropped the clutch in either first or second. Awesome to ride on the autobahn or the country B roads, way too twitchy to ride in town for my skill set.

[dgaddis]

Oh yeah, these latest liter bikes are around 200 horsepower and capable of 180+ mph on long tracks like COTA. My 2018 Triumph Street Triple RS is 765cc, no fairing, and should be able to hit about 140mph on the back straight of COTA. The most crazy thing is, screaming down that straight feels safe. The runoff is great and the brakes on these modern bikes are as amazing as the engines.

Watching the sport bikes at the drag strip was always....I dunno, fun, but also scary. Lots of the guys on them didn't have the experience to be out there and it was always skeeeeetchy. Watching my buddy blast down the strip was even scarier, not because he was sketchy (he wasn't), it's just that he's my buddy and I don't want him getting hurt haha.

At the drag strip, cars - even the really fast ones - only pull super hard for a short ways, then the acceleration dies off. Not the bikes. They look like they're just getting faster faster the faster they go.

[jerk]

Just get this: KTM - READY TO RACE

[jscottyk]

Fixed it for ya. :)

The R1 Cross Plane is amaze balls. I wouldn't say it sounds as good as a true V-Twin but it has a distinct aura about it. Listening to Cameron Beaubier's at Laguna Seca is surreal and is just plan angry.

My coworker has a 16 and it's truly something amazing. Chassis is so dialed that such little input is really needed and the IMU is out of this world. Lots of parts available for them and obviously you get the tuning fork reliability with Rossi's blessing. Damn ugly front end though. If I were plunking down money for one as a track bike I'd get the R1S. Saves about $2k right off the top.

I don't think there is a better bike all around than the V-four of the Aprilla. Most journo's would agree and the noise.......OMG. They were the first on many fronts including IMU tech. The only problem is the dealer network and overall reliability of spinning a motor 14K RPM all summer. The auto blipper on the 17 is pure freakin SEX!!!!!!

The new Ninja that REA is riding is pretty sweet to even though it's not even close to the same animal. Great chassis and good electronics as well.

The 959 I rode was one of the most disappointing bike riding experiences I've had in the last year. I really wanted to love it but it isn't meant for anything other than the track and at the RPM's it needs to be in it's a freaking rattle can and crotch burner. No thanks. I'll just look at them on my Instagram feed.

Rode my Speed today for about 2 hours in 37 degree weather. Damn I love 2 wheels.

Unless I stumble across just the right deal on a sorted 675R package, I think it’s down to the R1 or an RSV4.

I’m fortunate to have some great Aprilia resources available here in Austin with AF1. Oddly, Austin is one of the beachheads for the original Aprilia thing in the US. First there was Jay Bernhard and Mototek. He was importing gray market RS250, AF1-250, etc, long before there was Aprilia US. In that shop once worked Robert Pandya (future head of marketing for Aprilia US and currently with Polaris) and also Ed Cook and Micah Shoemaker, founders of AF1. I raced with that crew back then. All good dudes.

I think the Yamaha has a better electronics package. I think the Aprilia has a more interesting (and maybe better) motor. The Aprilia definitely looks better. The chassis of both are near perfect race setups. There is no-way I want the electronic suspension bits of an R1M, but the '17 RSV4 RF reportedly has the real deal Ohlins NIX and TTX stuff. Prepped R1s are much more available than prepped RSV4s.

Just get this: KTM - READY TO RACE

Oh, the RC390 has definitely been considered. It's raced in a MotoAmerica spec class, and there are of fully prepped bike available. If I would have seen this back in December I would have probably just bought it and be done with it.

2015 KTM RC390 Cup Bike + Race Package
That was a fully sorted, turn-key setup that went for $5500!!

When I was racing 15 years ago, lightweights were my thing. Honda RS125, then Aprilia RS250, and ultimately a super-single Wood-Rotax SJ676. I totally dig rolling through corners on lightweight race bike.

But, I'm not racing anymore and just want to have fun and be safe. And, the back straight at COTA calls me like a siren. Rolling out of T11, lighting the fuse and hitting 170+ before grabbing the brakes and jamming into T12 just isn't possible on a lightweight setup. If COTA wasn't easily accesable, I would probably not be considering the liter bikes.

The IMU has changed the game for liter bikes and mortals like us. If you are not familiar, check out this article.

Ask Mo Anything! Do We Really Need The Imu?

Damn I love 2 wheels.

Right?? Bicycle. Motorcycle. Road bike. Gravel bike. BMX bike. MTB. MX. Cruiser. Racebike. Naked bike. Tourer. Dual-sport. Goldwing. HD. Whatever. 2 wheels are just fun. Full stop.

[pdxmech13]

COTA is too big and that back stretch is LOOOONNNGGG on a bike like the KTM that's for sure.

Launch control on the R1 is pretty freaking awesome.

The Aprilla's electronics are the newest Bosch 7 or 8 Axis or is it Continental...... I forget but it is more advanced than the R1. Both are killer though.

Seriously though. With the new electronics on these new bikes, if you have the balls or wrist to ring out that throttle they'll give you one hell of a ride.

BTW......Is that Triumph RS of yours part of the Brembo Master Cylinder recall? I know it has the M50 spec calipers but don't know much about the master.

[Jonathan]

For a first track bike I'd buy somebody else's track bike. I'd also get the one with the cheapest body parts.

[jscottyk]

For a first track bike I'd buy somebody else's track bike. I'd also get the one with the cheapest body parts.

For sure. Great advice for anyone. This is far from my first track specific bike (see above) but I always start by looking for well sorted setups that are for sale.

[jscottyk]

COTA is too big and that back stretch is LOOOONNNGGG on a bike like the KTM that's for sure.

Launch control on the R1 is pretty freaking awesome.

The Aprilla's electronics are the newest Bosch 7 or 8 Axis or is it Continental...... I forget but it is more advanced than the R1. Both are killer though.

Seriously though. With the new electronics on these new bikes, if you have the balls or wrist to ring out that throttle they'll give you one hell of a ride.

BTW......Is that Triumph RS of yours part of the Brembo Master Cylinder recall? I know it has the M50 spec calipers but don't know much about the master.

Interesting. I knew they improved the Aprilia IMU for the ’17 but I have not found those specifics. That’s good info.

Still, every recent comparison I have found gives the nod to the Yamaha for traction control (specifically slide control) and to the Aprilia for fueling/throttle feel. The auto-blip function is not stock on Yamaha but like you mention for the Aprilia, reported to be amazing.

I wish I could test ride both of these on the track before making a decision, but in the end it will just have to come down to gut, which one “moves” me more, and the right deal.

Finding a sorted R1 like this is tempting.

I don’t think that Brembo recall impacts the Street Triple RS. Everything I have found about it points to the Speed Triples. The RS has a really sweet Brembo radial master cylinder that has adjustable ratios. That along with the M50 calipers makes for some great stoping.

[jscottyk]

I don’t think that Brembo recall impacts the Street Triple RS. Everything I have found about it points to the Speed Triples. The RS has a really sweet Brembo radial master cylinder that has adjustable ratios. That along with the M50 calipers makes for some great stoping.

More info on the Brembo radial master cylinder recall. I'm going to cross post this on the other Motorcycle thread. Safety first, ya'll!

And, I don't think the Speed Triple recall I found is this same thing.

[pdxmech13]

Nope. The recall on the Speed was wiring. Had that done the same time they took this out.

[jscottyk]

Nope. The recall on the Speed was wiring. Had that done the same time they took this out.

Where the "don't like" button??

Did you ever get an answer about root cause?

[pdxmech13]

It apparently passed all test with flying colors.

I have no ideas.......just going to ride it the next few years and then move on.

CB1000R or Tuono.....probably the Tuono, probably the Tuono.

[jscottyk]

It apparently passed all test with flying colors.

I have no ideas.......just going to ride it the next few years and then move on.

CB1000R or Tuono.....probably the Tuono, probably the Tuono.

Tuono. Definitely the Tuono. If I didn't have the 765 RS, that would definitely be on the list. It's basically an RSV4 with a bit more grunt and upright position.