Anyone use a tubing notcher? If so which one?

[triathloner]

I'm still practicing with the tig, plan to buy a torch soon and try my hand at that as well before I try the first bike. As for practicing I'm getting tired of filing my joints just for practicing. I was thinking of getting a tube notcher but I'm guessing the cheap ones aren't too high quality, but the expensive ones cost close to what a mill would run. Anyone using one they like that won't break the bank? If you use the a notcher do you just notch with a little extra room to spare and then still hand file the rest of the way? Thanks for your help. Al.

[ToddFarr]

Read through this thread. http://www.velocipedesalon.com/forum...ion-33237.html He's using one.

[nsasaki]

I took a framebuilding workshop with Tim Sanner in Palo Alto and we used a JD Squared, Inc. - TN-100 with good results. Tim mentioned he had some difficulty finding a drill that worked well with this cutter, but found that the cheap-o harbor freight 1/2" Variable Speed Reversible D-Handle Drill worked well. He said he tried using some name brand drills (Milwaukee, dewalt, etc) with poor results. I think he said faster speeds seem to work better. we also used plenty of cutting fluid to keep it lubricated.

I have heard that all of the cheaper ones wear out very quickly and have issues with mis-aligned cuts etc.

The JD2 notcher is ~200 with the drill being around $50 but you can usually find a coupon for 20% off. Not sure how much you are looking to spend, but i think you will end up spending more in the long run with cheaper tools.

[deepsix]

I have a JMR notcher (very high quality) sitting around that I could let go.
How about $300 shipped? This is the good one.

JMR Manufacturing :: Notcher :: JMR Tube Notcher

[triathloner]

Thanks for the replies everyone, deepsix that is truly a good offer and I would have jumped on it but I had a friend who has a machine shop look at the cheapish solution to mitering and we way make one. Al.

[DeeDub76]

Tube Miter 004.jpg

Here is what I fabbed up.

[Pritchett]

I have a JMR notcher (very high quality) sitting around that I could let go.
How about $300 shipped?

PM'ed you. I'll take it if it's still around.

[deepsix]

Thanks for the PMs on that notcher guys. Let me get through a couple busy days and I'll gather up some pictures of it and respond to the people are interested. I will reach out in order of those who pm'd me.

FYI it will include hole saws and some pretty clever (if I say so myself) machined bits for holding pipes in phase while cutting the second miter.

[fpavao]

Hello, reviving the thread here.

I'm looking to buy a tube notcher too but I'm thinking about something cheap and small (so that it fits in airmail). I've seen some very cheap and simple looking ones by Harbor Freight and Eastwood. They cost about 50 usd.


(Harbor Freight)


(Eastwood)

Are they any good? Another piece of information: I can only buy hss bi-metal hole saws here by Starret. I think they're kind of sloppy and have some misaligned teeth. I'll also be working on mild steel, which is softer but has a thicker wall (up to 1.5mm, probably).

I can use the notcher with either a hand drill or a small bench drill which is not the most rigid one around.

Any info is much appreciated.

[Andrew R Stewart]

I tried the Joint Jigger. It was a bit loose in the spindle, off center between the spindle and clamped tube and the clamp could dent thin wall tubes easily. With the 6ish TPI hole saws i used the teeth snagged easily and the resulting cut was off a few degrees (even when using a vernier protractor during set up, the cut would drift). I still had to fine tune the miter by hand file every time. I never adapted the jigger to stays. It was very similar to the ones you show.

Having said all that some of the issues were able to be worked around. I shimmed the spindle bearing block to center. With a surrounding tube sleeve the dents were eliminated. With a fast cutting speed and very slow feed the snagging was no issue. The slop and flex in the spindle which caused the drifting angle could be anticipateded with an angle setting a few degrees off.

But i tired of there waroundunds and decided that my meager building rate didn't need such automation. So i went back to simple hack sawing out a wedge, bench grinding to a scribed line and hand filing to fit. Just a few days ago i did my main triangle miters. The HT end of the DT and TT took about 15 minutes each, without rushing. The BB end of the DT was less then 10 minutes (lugged shell). As usual the ST end of the TT took longer, maybe 25 minutes.

If I were doing many miters of the sameI'dec i'd feel otherwise. Andy.

[afwalker]

I've got a cheapo one I never use and would let go for the shipping:)
I'll post a pic if anyone's interested.
cheers
andy walker

[false_aesthetic]

We had a Harbor Freight version of these in the welding cage at school. It was horrible.

You'll get a more accurate cut and get it faster using your teeth.

[Amaro Bikes]

I'm getting tired of filing my joints just for practicing

Hi Al

I know it's not what you're asking for and also it's a lot about personal points of view, but to me it would be much more intersting for you if you keep practicing with the files, even if it can take a bit longer at the begining. The kind of mitering needed for practicing tig skills (just fishmouths in different angles) can be done by hand pretty fast with a little bit of practice.
Building a frame is much more than just welding (in fact, much more than just building the frame, but that's another story), and the kind of knowledge you can learn from the manual mitering by eye-hand-file will be very useful for you in the future and to fully understand many of the causes and consecuences of each step of the procedure (never underestimate the manual skills).

Then, with the money you save not buying hole saws or tube notchers, you can actually buy many straight gauge tubes to get more hours of practice.

And again, just my humble 2 cents.

Cheers

[EricKeller]

never used a tube notcher, but from my experience notching on my lathe it's obviously an operation that requires a fairly rigid setup. Surprised you can do it on something like the HF notcher without breaking teeth on the saw

I noticed that Ant Bike Mike makes an Antolater Somewhere in his flickr stream you can find a picture of it being used in anger

[Will Neide]

never used a tube notcher, but from my experience notching on my lathe it's obviously an operation that requires a fairly rigid setup. Surprised you can do it on something like the HF notcher without breaking teeth on the saw

I noticed that Ant Bike Mike makes an Antolater Somewhere in his flickr stream you can find a picture of it being used in anger

I have this one: PRO-TOOLS Tube Benders | Pipe Benders | Tube and Pipe Bender | Pipe and Tube Benders

I'm still working out the set-up, and I think I'm fairly close to happy with it. I did however break some teeth initially trying to adhere to the "slow" speeds required for hole saws. It was tricky trying to modulate the speed with a hand drill. In the end, I found that if I just go full speed on the hand drill (750rpm?) it seemed to cut the smoothest. I am using Lenox hole saws. I haven't committed entirely to the setup yet though and still use cut off wheels and grinders/files for the thin tubes. I'll be happy if I can set it up to do chainstays and seatstays only.

[fpavao]

Thanks for all the replys. I'll try and get the one Andy Walker offered, at least for experimentation.

I was using a lathe and still had some problems with the saws theeth breaking also, so I guess everything really needs to be very rigid. I'll try fast rotations speeds also, I've been using very slow only. Anyway, now the engine on my lathe is kaputt and the new shop I'm moving to doesn't have much space available (my lathe is old an big).

I agree with Aimar also about using files for the first frames. I've finished my 15th frame using mostly files and I think I'm getting kind of good at it, but I need to step up production as I'm the only framebuilder in a radius of about 2000km and everyone is bugging me for a custom frame (yeah, not really complaining )

If I had the time, I'd probably build my own notcher and fit it to a good sized bench drill. But with opening the shop, importing tubesets and parts and everything else, there's not much I can do right now.

[afwalker]

Ok just started cleaning it up. Shaft turns smoothly,
looks like a copy
11180043025_f255a63f39_m.jpg
cheers
andy walker

[acorn]

Here's the thing about tube notchers. They suck. They don't cut thin wall tubing well because of all the vibration, you can easily tear a chunk of metal when you are cutting and ruin an expensive tube. I think that's why some guys use sanding type of notchers.

I discovered a trick recently. Tried it once and it seems to work, but I need to get some more experience with this before recommending it to everybody and people getting mad if it doesn't work for them. I'll explain now...

Here's what I did. BTW, I have tried the Harbor Freight cheapie tube notcher. It sucks. Doesn't cut on center. Actually, I have tried a few nice ones. The one I like the best and am using is called SyncNotcher. Type it into Google. A motorcycle nerd neighbor let me borrow his and it seemed good so I bought my own. Anyway, about my icing method. Oh, it's not actually my method. Some plumber told me to try this. Guess he was just smart. Just try this with a cheap tube first. Poor some water into the tube. Cap the ends. Use whatever you can to not let the water out. I had some leftover tube caps from Home Depot from some old gas pipes I Bought there. The pipe caps sucked, but I made it work with some extra Saran Wrap and tape. Anyway, put water in the tube, freeze it overnight in the freezer. That's it! Then, use the tube notcher of your choice and miter the tube. No more messed up, ripped out tearing of thin-wall tubes on the tube notcher! Seriously! Try it! So far, it has worked ok for me. And water is free!

[progetto]

A balloon would work as a cap as well.

[Mark Kelly]

A balloon would work as a cap as well.

Or a cut length of latex inner tube rolled over and pinched closed with a bulldog clip.

I occasionally use cut lengths of latex tube to hold down small bits on composite tubes during construction, it works a treat.